The 1962 Vatican Document on Clergy Sexual Abuse

[Charles Sloan]

The 1962 Vatican document detailing the official position and way to deal with sexual abuse by the clergy. It is a policy of secrecy and cover-up.

The highlighted document:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/8690038/The-1962-Vatican-Document-on-Clergy-Sexual-Abuse

[k-pappy]

Is this really necessary?

I personally disagree with most of the Catholic teachings, but do we really need to bring up a 50 year old document to discredit the church as a whole? 

When Christians fight among each other, or worse, say their opponents are not Christians, you are damaging Christ's Kingdom more than the enemy ever could.

In Christ,
KP

[Charles Sloan]

The news coverage is just over a year old, and the scandal continues to this day.

"And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them." -Eph 5:11

[CDHealy]

The video is a fraud.

The story is not new (it comes from several years ago), and it does not take into account the changes in discipline enacted in the 80s.

And after about three minutes of cobbled together video, the rest of the video goes on to criticize the Roman Catholic view of the mass (which also not surprisingly distorts that view--for example that it is the priest that makes the change, which the Roman Catholic Church does not actually teach), and a VERY dishonest attack on statutes.  All, of course, from "former Jesuits."

The video is a completely dishonest and uncharitable waste of time, deceptive to its core.

That said, let me also assert my disgust at the manifest covering up that has taken place in the U.S. Catholic Church of sexual abuse on minors by clergy.  But one does not need to invent secret document conspiracies or distort Catholic teaching.  Catholic priest abusers, almost all of them of homosexual orientation, were aided and abetted by some of their superiors.  Some were appropriately disciplined.  Most were not.

And this phenomenon is not the exclusive property of the Roman Catholic Church, homosexually oriented abuses of teenage boys exist in all religions, and even among evangelical Protestant denominations--and nearly every group has a coverup problem.  It's not a matter of secret documents, it's much more basic than that: cya, no one wants to get sued or go to jail.

[kensington]

And this phenomenon is not the exclusive property of the Roman Catholic Church, homosexually oriented abuses of teenage boys exist in all religions, and even among evangelical Protestant denominations--and nearly every group has a coverup problem.  It's not a matter of secret documents, it's much more basic than that: cya, no one wants to get sued or go to jail.



NOT on the grand scale of sin and lies and abuse that was contrived by the Catholic Church.  All religions have sin, that is true...  But not on this level of hypocrisy. NONE can match up with what the Catholic Church did for all those decades.  NONE.  There has been no coverups that have gone this deep or gone this high up.  One of those who ignored it and turned their back on it when it was in his hands to stop it is now your seated Pope.  So, lets not pretend that "All" religions are like the Catholic Church in this arena.

[CDHealy]

NOT on the grand scale of sin and lies and abuse that was contrived by the Catholic Church.  All religions have sin, that is true...  But not on this level of hypocrisy. NONE can match up with what the Catholic Church did for all those decades.  NONE.  There has been no coverups that have gone this deep or gone this high up.  One of those who ignored it and turned their back on it when it was in his hands to stop it is now your seated Pope.  So, lets not pretend that "All" religions are like the Catholic Church in this arena.

Kensie, sweetie, I'm not Roman Catholic, so he's not "my" Pope.

Would you like to submit evidence to back up your slanders?

But one so consumed with hatred for the Catholic Church will never be able to see things clearly: you're consumed by your own bile.

[Charles Sloan]

The story is not new (it comes from several years ago), and it does not take into account the changes in discipline enacted in the 80s.

I'm sorry, your right its from 2003.

[kensington]

NOT on the grand scale of sin and lies and abuse that was contrived by the Catholic Church.  All religions have sin, that is true...  But not on this level of hypocrisy. NONE can match up with what the Catholic Church did for all those decades.  NONE.  There has been no coverups that have gone this deep or gone this high up.  One of those who ignored it and turned their back on it when it was in his hands to stop it is now your seated Pope.  So, lets not pretend that "All" religions are like the Catholic Church in this arena.

Kensie, sweetie, I'm not Roman Catholic, so he's not "my" Pope.

Would you like to submit evidence to back up your slanders?

But one so consumed with hatred for the Catholic Church will never be able to see things clearly: you're consumed by your own bile.

Sure, read the Sermons of Sister Jane Kelly or watch it on the Catholic Channel.   She speaks it, evidences it and the church validates it.  Until you have done that, don't dismiss what I post as slander.  And I am not your sweetie... people who talk that way make me ill. 

[Imabear]

Is this really necessary?

I personally disagree with most of the Catholic teachings, but do we really need to bring up a 50 year old document to discredit the church as a whole? 

When Christians fight among each other, or worse, say their opponents are not Christians, you are damaging Christ's Kingdom more than the enemy ever could.

In Christ,
KP

Agreed.
I don't see much good coming out of threads like this. 
Most of the Catholics and Lutherans alive today had nothing to do with the holocaust. 
It's sort of like blaming you and me for the atrocities perpetrated on the Native Americans by our government.

[Lee Freeman]

Threads like this wear me out. I've been a regular viewer of EWTN for 20 years and have been reading Catholic theology written by Catholic theologiasns for as long. I'm not an apologist for Catholicism because I do not agree with many of its doctrinal teachings however I would like to see it fairly represented, which it isn't in this thread and the one about Pius XII and the Nazis.

The Catholic Church historically may have done some bad things, yes, but show me a church today which hasn't. Every denomination has its hypocrites. For Every Catholic Borgia pope there's a Protestant Jim Jones, Jimmy Swaggert, or Jim Bakker.

Catholics persecuted Protestants, true, but how many Catholics did Protestants kill? How many recusant Catholics did Anglican Elizabeth I's government kill or deport?

And if one studies the Middle Ages carefully one will see immediately that without the Catholic Church Europe really would've been in the "Dark Ages." The same is true of the Orthodox Church in Eastern Europe. Without the stabilizing and civilizing influence of the Church Medieval Europe would've been way worse than it actually was.

Regardless, in a very real sense, the Catholic Church of 2008 is not the same Catholic Church of 1099 or 1517 or 1933 or 1965.

If Protestants and Catholics cannot or will not stop misrepresenting each others' faiths we will never get anywhere.

Pax.

[Charles Sloan]

Lee, the video is a television news broadcast and link is to the actual document.

So I don't see where you get off saying this is misrepresented.

[Charles Sloan]

You know what, I thought the video was just the news broadcast. I didn't realize it was an expose that was pieced together from other sources. Sorry, I was trying to present some honest information just for informational purposes because this topic was brought up in another thread.

I removed the video until I find the correct one.

[Lee Freeman]

Lee, the video is a television news broadcast and link is to the actual document.

So I don't see where you get off saying this is misrepresented.

And the fact that it's a TV news broadcast means that it cannot be spin? C'mon, Charles. The only faith community the secular media hates worse than fundamentalist Evangelicals is conservative Roman Catholics. The media routinely take shots at the Vatican.

Look, I'm all for criticizing where and when its due, but I'm not all for slamming a major Christian faith community without good reason.

We Protestants have enough logs in our own eyes to remove before we go around trying to remove the splinters (or even logs) in the Vatican's eyes.

Pax.

[Charles Sloan]

Look, I'm all for criticizing where and when its due, but I'm not all for slamming a major Christian faith community without good reason.

Are you seriously suggesting  that all the repeated acts of child molestation isn't a good enough reason when the Vatican actually issues a document that details their knowledge of the problem and the decision to protect its officials and not the children?

That is just sick.

[Lee Freeman]

Look, I'm all for criticizing where and when its due, but I'm not all for slamming a major Christian faith community without good reason.

Are you seriously suggesting  that all the repeated acts of child molestation isn't a good enough reason when the Vatican actually issues a document that details their knowledge of the problem and the decision to protect its officials and not the children?

That is just sick.

I'm not condoning anyone's bad behavior. What I'm saying is that I'm not in favor holding the whole Catholic Church responsible for the deplorable actions of a few.

Dr. Philip Jenkins, an Episcopalian and Professor of History and Religious Studies at Penn State University states in his 1996 book Pedophiles and Priests: Anatomy of a Contemporary Crisis stated:

"My research of cases over the past 20 years indicates no evidence whatever that Catholic or other celibate clergy are any more likely to be involved in misconduct or abuse than clergy of any other denomination—or indeed, than nonclergy. However determined news media may be to see this affair as a crisis of celibacy, the charge is just unsupported."

If I remember correctly, Jenkins concluded that only about 5 per cent of American Catholic priests were guilty of sexual misconduct and of these only .02 per cent are/were actually child molesters. He says these figures are pretty much exactly the same as you'd find in any other denomination or religious group. So why don't we hear about the pedophilia cases in these other groups?

Pax.