Being honest with other Christians about how you REALLY feel...

[Mikeyjc]

Lately I have been hearing a recurring theme in conversation with other believers. The topic of coversation (and I had another one with a brother in the Lord at work this morning) is do Christians really tell the truth about how they really feel or think?  How real are we to each other?  How much do we hide?  Do we project that our lives are better than what they really are?  Do we build ourselves up to be in better spiritual shape than what we really are?  Do we make ourselves out to be more 'with it' then what is the honest norm for us?

I have heard it said so often lately that we Christians stretch the truth sometimes about how we are really doing in this life and in particular in our spiritual life.  Why is that?  Do we fear rejection?  Judgement?  Disapproval?  Are we afraid that if we share with someone our real struggles that they might want to avoid us?  Is it embarrassment?

I don't know...I thought that I would just throw this out and see what the consensus is out there with all of you.  As for me, I let anger get the better of me today and took some things out on God.  No--it had nothing to do with my dad.  I just became painfully aware again that this anger is more deeply rooted than I care to admit to and I still need a major break through in coming to terms with it and allowing the LORD to heal me of this debilitating affliciton.

What do you think? Inquring minds want to know  At least mine does!

Thanks for reading this.  Any comments?  I honestly think most of us in the Church struggle with this thing.  (not the anger issue)--the 'telling it like it is'  thingy.

With warm greetings from the Land of Ice and Snow!

Michael

P.S.:  It stormed again.  I might be a Canadian but I have no use for winter!

[kensington]

I think we do "protect" our real spiritual situation.  We know who we can be totally open with, faults and all, and who we can't.  I think it has to do with KNOWING that there is judgment and disapproval going around.  Unless we are blind.

I think it is a sign of the times that we really don't confess our sins one to another... knowing that sister flapping tongue will not hold our confidence and pray with us, but head straight for the nearest ear to tickle "just so we can pray for them"... 

We must be "quiet as the dove, as sly as the serpent"...  protecting ourselves. 

[Wordman]

Yes, I think lots of christians do struggle with trying to live up to a certain image.  And that image is that they have total faith in God, but in reality, I think everyone has doubts at one time or another, but lot christians feel they cannot admit such a thing out loud to others.  Which is why we get many atheists-to-christians and christians-to-atheists...and than back and forth again.

The bible says we must live by "faith", which of course is an irony, because living by "faith" is what causes the doubts.  Since if we "know" God is real, than we can no longer live by "faith", but instead live by "knowledge".   

Therefore, all christians that live by faith is part agnostic, unless they are delusional...   Sorry it's true, but don't be ashame, because it's a good delusion, a sickness of the mind that I wish I had...

Look at it this way, if any christian claims their faith is super-duper strong and infallible, than howcome they can't move mountains, nor can they walk on water?  Jesus says if our faith is as strong as a mustard seed than we can command mountains.  So how many people do you know, that can walk on water, or rebuke a storm? 

And than, there are christians that "know", but they don't qualify with the term living with "faith", but rather, they are living by "knowledge".

Which of course is another irony, because Jesus lived by knowledge, he did not require faith because he knew God was real....how?  Because he was God...

So until I "know", I am not ashame to admit my insecurity,  thus I will continue to be an Agnostic-Christian-Buddhist...



"I do not think that I will ever reach a stage when I will say, 'This is what I believe. Finished.' What I believe is alive... and open to growth." -- Madeleine L'Engle
 
 

[chosenone]

I think we do "protect" our real spiritual situation.  We know who we can be totally open with, faults and all, and who we can't.  I think it has to do with KNOWING that there is judgment and disapproval going around.  Unless we are blind.

I think it is a sign of the times that we really don't confess our sins one to another... knowing that sister flapping tongue will not hold our confidence and pray with us, but head straight for the nearest ear to tickle "just so we can pray for them"... 

We must be "quiet as the dove, as sly as the serpent"...  protecting ourselves. 

Kensington
I think you are right. Many christians I have known are very reluctant to allow others to know that they are anything but perfect. In a church that I used to go to for 10 years I always felt inadequate because so many there seemd to have it all together, and seemed to have perfect families, perfect marriages. perfect faith etc etc.Of course they didnt, but that is how it appeared to be. The next church that I went to many years later was the opposite and everyone was aLmost encouraged to have problems and difficulties and the pastor seemd to imply that EVERYONE need to go up for prayer after wards becuase we must ALL be needing it. If you didnt go up for prayer it was occasionally implied that we were deceiving oursleves if we thought that we didnt need it!
I feel that we need somewhere in the middle. Prayer and help for those who really are struggling and thanks to God for those who are going through a good strong time.

The problem that I have is on a forum such as this. I let it be known that I am in a second marriage and that my first husband and my husbands first wife committed sexual immorality, and a few people (very few thankfully) did use it against me and I was accused many many times of being an adulteress. Thankfully these people have disappeared and so now I wonder if I should have shared that, as it was used in a bad way. Now I do hesitate to say anything again like that just in case. I am fine about admitting my weaknesses and struggles to my husbands kids and close friends, but whether I will on here I dont know. I am naturally a chatty person on forums but how far to go??

Wordman
being involved in Buddism really wont help your faith at all. God is a jealous God and wont share his throne.Personally I would keep well away from anything that is anything to do with another god. I sort of see it like being married but flirting with someone else or having a sort of emotional affair with them (or even a physical afffair with them). That can only ruin the original marriage and will never do it any good.
God once led me to repent of taking my shoes off and going into a mosque when visiting Israel 30 years ago when I wasnt following him, as this is a sort of worship to their god.We have to have him and Him alone on the throne. Even just dipping our little toe into something else causes all sorts of problems.

[Wordman]

Wordman
being involved in Buddism really wont help your faith at all. God is a jealous God and wont share his throne.Personally I would keep well away from anything that is anything to do with another god. I sort of see it like being married but flirting with someone else or having a sort of emotional affair with them (or even a physical afffair with them). That can only ruin the original marriage and will never do it any good.
God once led me to repent of taking my shoes off and going into a mosque when visiting Israel 30 years ago when I wasnt following him, as this is a sort of worship to their god.We have to have him and Him alone on the throne. Even just dipping our little toe into something else causes all sorts of problems.

Buddha is not a God, nor did Buddha ever claim to be God.   True Buddhism is a philosophy, which in many ways mirrors the Gospels of Jesus...and kind of just explains it more in detail, and shows us how practicing "true love for everthing" leads to peace and happiness.

You should give it a read; you will be surprise at how logical and reasonable it is. 

Jesus says the Kingdom of Heaven is inside "you".   Buddha says the same thing, but than, Buddha goes on to give logical and reasonable steps in great detail as to-how-to actually find it inside each of us.   

[chosenone]

Wordman
being involved in Buddism really wont help your faith at all. God is a jealous God and wont share his throne.Personally I would keep well away from anything that is anything to do with another god. I sort of see it like being married but flirting with someone else or having a sort of emotional affair with them (or even a physical afffair with them). That can only ruin the original marriage and will never do it any good.
God once led me to repent of taking my shoes off and going into a mosque when visiting Israel 30 years ago when I wasnt following him, as this is a sort of worship to their god.We have to have him and Him alone on the throne. Even just dipping our little toe into something else causes all sorts of problems.

Buddha is not a God, nor did Buddha ever claim to be God.   True Buddhism is a philosophy, which in many ways mirrors the Gospels of Jesus...and kind of just explains it more in detail, and shows us how practicing "true love for everthing" leads to peace and happiness.

You should give it a read; you will be surprise at how logical and reasonable it is. 

Jesus says the Kingdom of Heaven is inside "you".   Buddha says the same thing, but than, Buddha goes on to give logical and reasonable steps in great detail as to-how-to actually find it inside each of us.   

Dont think I will be reading it. When you  have found the one true path why do you need another?

[Wordman]

Wordman
being involved in Buddism really wont help your faith at all. God is a jealous God and wont share his throne.Personally I would keep well away from anything that is anything to do with another god. I sort of see it like being married but flirting with someone else or having a sort of emotional affair with them (or even a physical afffair with them). That can only ruin the original marriage and will never do it any good.
God once led me to repent of taking my shoes off and going into a mosque when visiting Israel 30 years ago when I wasnt following him, as this is a sort of worship to their god.We have to have him and Him alone on the throne. Even just dipping our little toe into something else causes all sorts of problems.

Buddha is not a God, nor did Buddha ever claim to be God.   True Buddhism is a philosophy, which in many ways mirrors the Gospels of Jesus...and kind of just explains it more in detail, and shows us how practicing "true love for everthing" leads to peace and happiness.

You should give it a read; you will be surprise at how logical and reasonable it is. 

Jesus says the Kingdom of Heaven is inside "you".   Buddha says the same thing, but than, Buddha goes on to give logical and reasonable steps in great detail as to-how-to actually find it inside each of us.   

Dont think I will be reading it. When you  have found the one true path why do you need another?

True. True.

I haven't found the "true" path yet...so I will keep looking.

"Was it not you I sought all along? Is this love? It must be love. For I am here, always waiting for you. Did I lose you...each time...because I didn't recognize you? Did I lose you...each time...because I did recognize you but was afraid? Lose you because each time, recognizing you, but in the end... I knew I had to lose you?" "What kind of love is this that keeps me hanging on, despite everything it's doing to me? Surely, it can only end in misery"    -- Umberto Eco, Foucault's Pendulum

[chosenone]

I hope that you find it wordman. Jesus IS the only way, He really is.

[Bonnie]

I hope that you find it wordman. Jesus IS the only way, He really is.

Amen, He is the door to the sheep's fold.

[llewksgood]

Well... before you accuse someone of being cagey you might get to know them first. With some people their positive attitude is simply because they've learned to trust God in such a way that, what appear to be mountains to others, are mere molehills to them.

With others, well... their potty training is going well, so you'd better keep encouraging them.

[Jon-Marc]

One thing I have found with some "Christians" is that too often they don't want to hear the truth about how you are. I was criticized in one "Christian" forum for mentioning my sorry-excuse-for-a-dad and how his abuse still affects the way I think. Trusting and living by faith are not easy for some of us, but it seems that most Christians would prefer that you lie to them and say that "Life is great, and I'm rejoicing all the time. I have no problems whatsoever."

[OneLung]

Everyone knows a "Debbie Downer," which is why the skit was so successful on SNL.  In real life, it's an attitude that will soon cost you most of your family and friends.

[fanuvmxpx]

People are in different positions in their walks & areas of trust with the Lord. After bills today, I had $0.16 in my checking account. That would probably scare some people, but God provided for every single one of my needs and I still have money. Money is probably my biggest life worry.

For others, it might be appearance (attire or life). My parents were very big on "looking ok" even if we weren't...I never understood it...and now live the exact opposite of that mentality. Nothing wrong with saying "I'm broke" or "Family is feuding"...its such a small matter, when God is so big/great.

My wife calls me blunt. I say I don't give in to embarrassment. Take your pick 

[Mikeyjc]

I am not advocating that we all moan and wail at each other about our difficulties with reckless abandon.  What I was trying to touch on is that in general I think we have a tendency to embellish our spiritual life with each other.  When it comes to opening up and sharing about our failures, disappointments, and shortcomings we need to be discerning as to whom we can share with openly.  We need to be wise and exercise a measure of caution. 

My wife hates when I answer a question with the word fine.  She says fine  is the Christian "F word".

I do believe that in the Church we experience a kind of peer pressure.  Maybe that's what keeps us on our toes and constantly projecting that we are in control and that things are unfolding in our world as they should be.

Anyway, some of you here who 'know' me are fully aware that I have shared  some matters pertaining to my personal life  I don't regret any of it.  I don't recommend that everybody here 'let it all hang out'.  Some can go out on a limb and be quite comfortable about it, some would suffer deep regret if they tried to share on too deep a level.  You just have to know what your own boundaries are. 

[OneLung]

Everyone complains sometimes. But no matter how many spoonfulls of pretty, comforting words you use to sugar coat it, chronic useless whining is still chronic useless whining. It doesn't do you, or anyone who hears it, any good. Much better to spend the time and energy doing something you like to do.

[Mikeyjc]

Here's a joke for you...

A young man desired to be a monk.  So he ran away and joined a monastery.  In this particular order the monks could say only two words  once every 10 years.  This they did to their superior.

After his first 10 years of service the young monk was brought into the superior's office and he said, "Bed hard."  He put in another 10 years of service and again when he was brought into the office he said, "Food bad."  After another 10 years in the monastery when he spoke to his superior he said, "Too cold."

Well, he put in another 10 years and this time when he sat down in the little office and looked across at his superior he said, "I quit."

The head monk folded his arms across his chest and said, "Well, I'm not surprised.  You've done nothing but complain ever since you've come here."

[Rahn]

I am not advocating that we all moan and wail at each other about our difficulties with reckless abandon.  What I was trying to touch on is that in general I think we have a tendency to embellish our spiritual life with each other.  When it comes to opening up and sharing about our failures, disappointments, and shortcomings we need to be discerning as to whom we can share with openly.  We need to be wise and exercise a measure of caution. 

My wife hates when I answer a question with the word fine.  She says fine  is the Christian "F word".

I do believe that in the Church we experience a kind of peer pressure.  Maybe that's what keeps us on our toes and constantly projecting that we are in control and that things are unfolding in our world as they should be.

Anyway, some of you here who 'know' me are fully aware that I have shared  some matters pertaining to my personal life  I don't regret any of it.  I don't recommend that everybody here 'let it all hang out'.  Some can go out on a limb and be quite comfortable about it, some would suffer deep regret if they tried to share on too deep a level.  You just have to know what your own boundaries are. 

Fine. I am fine. Life is like sandpaper. There are different grades. When we share we rub up against each other. Sometimes what happens turns out to be smooth comfortable relationships. At other times. they are down right out rough.

I have worked with belt sanders and various other sanders. A belt sander can strip off too much if you are not careful. Sometimes you have to be gentle and sometimes you have to go a little deeper. You do not want to tear things up.

There have been times that I wanted to be completely honest but that would be too rough. I have done that and rubbed people the wrong way. They do not want to be rubbed. They may not care. I try to avoid those people. Unfortunately, I have more or less quit sharing except for a select few.

[Serenity432001]

One can only do this well when they know true humility and the reason this is true is when one is truely humble then they are not bothered with what others think about them because it just doesn't matter.  Pride stands in our way of rigorous honesty.   

[fanuvmxpx]

I do believe that in the Church we experience a kind of peer pressure.  Maybe that's what keeps us on our toes and constantly projecting that we are in control and that things are unfolding in our world as they should be.

This is only true in man's established church gatherings. Once you get beyond that, and realize we're all flawed, the peer pressure disappears. At least it did for me, can't speak for everyone :). The Word of God keeps me on my toes, and outside of God's will for my life I could really care less what anyone thinks of me. Our fruit should speak for ourselves.

Its another form of bondage...wanting to "project" that you are doing "super" even if your not, so as to appear to have control of one's life I would think. Peer pressure in a sense...I was raised to project the peer pressure image, its a wonderful chain to release.

[Jon-Marc]

It seems that too many Christians have the idea that in order to be spiritual you have to "suffer in silence", and if you complain about anything you're not being spiritual. If we don't tell people the truth, how can they pray for us? I can go to church, be in terrible pain, and lie when asked, "How are you today? Instead of lying to them for fear of being considered "unspiritual", I usually tell them how I feel. If people don't want to know, they shouldn't ask. My mother was one you didn't want to ask, "How are you today?" She would tell you exactly how she felt, and she had a LOT of ailments!

[Arkstfan]

In small group years ago most no one had prayer requests about themselves. Neighbors aunt is upset because her parakeet died was more the vein. I tried setting an example of announcing good things even little trival things just to extract something of consequences. Then a friend of mine joined and boy he'd lay it out there. "I was distracted at meeting by the presenter's low cut dress and really struggled. I cursed a person who cut me off on the commute home. My daughter asked me why I didn't come to family day at school" and on it would go.

I finally asked him why he was always so forthcoming (and I appreciated it) and he said, "I just want my brothers and sisters to quit being afraid of admitting that they haven't been resurrected into complete perfection yet."

[fanuvmxpx]

It seems that too many Christians have the idea that in order to be spiritual you have to "suffer in silence", and if you complain about anything you're not being spiritual. If we don't tell people the truth, how can they pray for us? I can go to church, be in terrible pain, and lie when asked, "How are you today? Instead of telling lying to them for fear of being considered "unspiritual", I usually tell them how I feel. If people don't want to know, they shouldn't ask. My mother was one you didn't want to ask, "How are you today?" She would tell you exactly how she felt, and she had a LOT of ailments!

I respect that about you Jon-Marc. And bless you for sharing, rest assured people are praying for ya!

[Mikeyjc]

I know right now that some Christians here will say that I am playing with fire, setting myself up for a fall etc...But my resolve to not drink alcohol is so resolute I can do this.  I know that some Christians who have battled with alcoholism in the past would not touch this stuff for fear of being led astray into sin again.

What am I talking about?--non-alcoholic beer and wine.

My preference is the German beer Becks.  It has 0% alcohol.  Anyway, besides that point it does not contain sugar and any hint of sweetness really turns me off.  Carl Jung 'champagne' is a favourite of mine also.

There was a time where this indulgence was not okay for me--years ago.  But now I am so resolved to abstain from alcohol that I can handle this stuff without any problem from my conscience.  The only thing that I am careful about is to not drink it around anybody who night be offended or uncomfortable about it.

I do not drink a lot of the non-alcoholic stuff by any stretch of the imagination.  My consumption of it is more or less sparse.  I do enjoy an ice cold Becks during a summer scorcher when the humidity is high.  But then again  a Perrier with lime is just as good.

One of the prime reasons I can handle this stuff without fear is fear of a different kind--I have such a stark fear of being hooked on alcohol I will not drink a regular beer etc.  No way.  The fear is so deeply rooted. 

If you throw me into a pool filled with beer--no problem for me.  You can wave a shot of whisky under my nose and again--no problem.  But one drop of a regular alcoholic drink-BIG PROBLEM.

Sorry--this was meant for the 'alcoholism thread'. 

[OneLung]

This common sense application of self discipline based on your realistic understanding of a known problem puts you miles ahead of those who choose to view themselves as some kind of victim.

[fanuvmxpx]

This common sense application of self discipline based on your knowledge of a known problem puts you miles ahead of those who choose to view themselves as some kind of victim.

Yup. And its a great example of how we all struggle with different things. To me, drinking an alcoholic beverage is no different than ice tea or a smoothie, but then again I've never consumed mass quantities in a party-style fashion either.

[Mikeyjc]

Sorry to unintentionally get off topic here...but maybe I am lazy tonight--I just did not want to wipe out my post and re-post it in the other thread.

Maybe I can get back to topic...sooooooooooooooooooooo...I will tell you how I REALLY feel about my drinking non/a (non-alcohol) Becks...I do not believe I sin when I drink this beer UNLESS I drink it infront of you and you are troubled by seeing me with a beer in my hand.

There!

[HRoberson]

There are social conventions that people in general use.
There are appropriate places to express your (completely) true situation.
There are appropriate people to whom you could express your (completely) true situation.

And then there is the possibility that a lot of folks want to think that some of us are having a bad life when we really aren't.

Not every day goes the way I want it to go. Not every day is stress-free. Not every day do I get the gold ring. But I have decided that what matters most is the faithfulness of God. That, despite the kind of day I'm having, gives me good ground to say "I have no reason not to have a good day."

That's the way I see it.

[memmy]

I just heard someone say this week, "We as Christians tend to shoot our wounded". That made me really stop and think.

[chosenone]

I just heard someone say this week, "We as Christians tend to shoot our wounded". That made me really stop and think.

Especially if they are divorced and remarried...............

[Serenity432001]

I just heard someone say this week, "We as Christians tend to shoot our wounded". That made me really stop and think.

Hey mems!  Good to hear from ya!   That really does make us stop and think, doesn't it.  Someone said that to me probably 15 years ago and I've NEVER forgotten it.  Mainly, because its so true.  I've seen it done time and time again.  Like chosenone has said, the divorce and remarried get a big dose of this but I've also seen it happen with other struggling Christians.  The point is Jesus was about healing the sick, not hoarding over them with better than thou attitudes although He, of course, IS  better than thou so if He didn't even do it, I'd dare say none of us needs to be. 

And as far as being honest with one another, this is precisely why those on the outside looking in WILL NOT get honest, because, they know they will be judged instead of loved and that SHOULD NOT BE in the Christian community. 

[Serenity432001]

There are social conventions that people in general use.
There are appropriate places to express your (completely) true situation.
There are appropriate people to whom you could express your (completely) true situation.

And then there is the possibility that a lot of folks want to think that some of us are having a bad life when we really aren't.

Not every day goes the way I want it to go. Not every day is stress-free. Not every day do I get the gold ring. But I have decided that what matters most is the faithfulness of God. That, despite the kind of day I'm having, gives me good ground to say "I have no reason not to have a good day."

That's the way I see it.

I like this Hr, especially this part:   

But I have decided that what matters most is the faithfulness of God. That, despite the kind of day I'm having, gives me good ground to say "I have no reason not to have a good day."

I just lost a very good friend yesterday who had this very attitude.  She was 81 years old.  She was very helpful to me in being able to be honest and helping me understand that God is in control.   It is rare when you find someone who you know good and well you can tell them absolutley anything and they will love you and not judge you.  I'm REALLY going to miss her but because of her I know that God will provide whatever or whoever I might need. 

[Mikeyjc]

There are social conventions that people in general use.
There are appropriate places to express your (completely) true situation.
There are appropriate people to whom you could express your (completely) true situation.

And then there is the possibility that a lot of folks want to think that some of us are having a bad life when we really aren't.

Not every day goes the way I want it to go. Not every day is stress-free. Not every day do I get the gold ring. But I have decided that what matters most is the faithfulness of God. That, despite the kind of day I'm having, gives me good ground to say "I have no reason not to have a good day."

That's the way I see it.

I like this Hr, especially this part:   

But I have decided that what matters most is the faithfulness of God. That, despite the kind of day I'm having, gives me good ground to say "I have no reason not to have a good day."

I just lost a very good friend yesterday who had this very attitude.  She was 81 years old.  She was very helpful to me in being able to be honest and helping me understand that God is in control.   It is rare when you find someone who you know good and well you can tell them absolutley anything and they will love you and not judge you.  I'm REALLY going to miss her but because of her I know that God will provide whatever or whoever I might need. 

I had a dear friend who was basically a spiritual mother to me for many years.  She taught me many things about God and backed up her lessons with wonderful life-lived stories.  I miss her too--she's with the Lord now.  Despite the difference in our ages she was one of the best friends I ever had.  She had been a real gift from the Lord.

My condolences on your loss Serenity432001...but I rejoice that you are not grieving as those in the world.

Michael

[the J Man]

 

The problem that I have is on a forum such as this. I let it be known that I am in a second marriage and that my first husband and my husbands first wife committed sexual immorality, and a few people (very few thankfully) did use it against me and I was accused many many times of being an adulteress. Thankfully these people have disappeared and so now I wonder if I should have shared that, as it was used in a bad way. Now I do hesitate to say anything again like that just in case. I am fine about admitting my weaknesses and struggles to my husbands kids and close friends, but whether I will on here I dont know. I am naturally a chatty person on forums but how far to go??

Jesus never did that to the Samaritan woman at the well. She had 5 previous husbands. There must have been something wrong with her attitude to go through that amount of husbands. Jesus knew what she had done, yet did not condemn her. He reached out to her. We are supposed to do that too. What you did in your past is none anyone's business and they have no right condemning you.

If they can't say something that speaks life, then they should shut up and not say anything at all. But the problem is, they themselves are full of religion. They do not have relationship with God, they only have religion. They may have head knowledge, but no heart knowledge.
They know how to use scripture, but they never use their heart.

[the J Man]

I just heard someone say this week, "We as Christians tend to shoot our wounded". That made me really stop and think.

Yep! That is how Satan destroys christians. By getting them to destroy each other. Sadly, it works very well.

[the J Man]

Maybe I can get back to topic...sooooooooooooooooooooo...I will tell you how I REALLY feel about my drinking non/a (non-alcohol) Becks...I do not believe I sin when I drink this beer UNLESS I drink it infront of you and you are troubled by seeing me with a beer in my hand.

There!

There is nothing sinful about it. Non-alcoholic beverages don't destroy lives. Alcohol has destroyed many. The Word of God speaks against drunkensness and the effects of strong drink, not against non alcoholic beverages. Non alcohlic beverages are not "strong drink. "