Who were the Only ONES that had free will ??

[dan p]

 Hi to all , and many believe in free will , but most all , is taken out o9f Context .

As far as I can see in my bible there were only three that`has free Will !

The first group were angels and that was Lucifer in his famous 5 , "I  wills " in Ezek 28:6-19 and in Isa 14:12-17 .

The others were Adam and Eve in the garden !!

What say you ??

[chestertonrules]

Hi to all , and many believe in free will , but most all , is taken out o9f Context .

As far as I can see in my bible there were only three that`has free Will !

The first group were angels and that was Lucifer in his famous 5 , "I  wills " in Ezek 28:6-19 and in Isa 14:12-17 .

The others were Adam and Eve in the garden !!

What say you ??

All men have free will.

God wants us to love him.  Love is impossible without free will.

[dan p]

/quote]

Hi chester , and I understand why you say that ,  BUT Paul says we are ALL  dead in trespasses and sins .

If we are spiritually   DEAD  in sins , How can a dead man respone

Paul , in 1 Cor 2:14 , says  ' But  the natural man (  since Adam and Eve  )   receiveth  NOT  the things of the SPIRIT  of   

God , for4 they are foolishness unto him ".

The answer to me is found is found the the term Election and Eph 2:8 , for salvation  " it is the gift of God ."  dan p

[chestertonrules]

That's not all that Paul says.

We are dead in sin without God's grace, but then comes the good news!!

1 Cor 15
For since death came through a human being, the resurrection of the dead has also come through a human being; for as all die in Adam, so all will be made alive in Christ.

Titus 2:11
For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men.

Romans 5:18
Therefore just as one man's trespass led to condemnation for all, so one man's act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all.

Now is the judgment of this world; now the ruler of this world will be driven out. And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.John 12:31-32

[dan p]

  Hi , and what scripture can anyone reveal that awakes a dead man as 1 Cor 2:14 , for the word of God says it is 

FOOLISHNESS unto him , so How does he exercise  free will ??

[chestertonrules]

  Hi , and what scripture can anyone reveal that awakes a dead man as 1 Cor 2:14 , for the word of God says it is 

FOOLISHNESS unto him , so How does he exercise  free will ??

All men have been made alive, ie. awakened, in Christ.

Now we must choose to accept God's grace or reject it.

   
Titus 2:11
For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men.


John 12:31,2
Now is the judgment of this world; now the ruler of this world will be driven out. And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.


1 Cor 15:21,2
For since death came through a human being, the resurrection of the dead has also come through a human being; for as all die in Adam, so all will be made alive in Christ.



Rom 11:32
For God has imprisoned all in disobedience so that he may be merciful to all.
Rom 11:32

[dan p]

  Hi  , and I believe every verse that you have written , but none of them have explained  HOW  a dead man can than understand as referenced in 1 Cor 2:14 .

A dead man or woman believes as referenced in Acts 16:14, as the Lord  OPENED  the  HEART of Lydia .

It is by election and as Eph 2:8 as says it is the Faith  THAT  God gives which is a  GIFT , otherwise we stay  DEAD  MAN and  WOMEN .

That is how we are made alive and we as men in the flesh can not make3 our selves alive , dan p

Read Acts 9:6 and we see that is Christ that saved him as  Saul was on his way to Damascus .

Was Saul  SEEKING  God ?    No he was not !!

Where was Sauls free will ??

It was by election , pure and simple , and that is the way that I see it , dan p

[chestertonrules]

 Hi  , and I believe every verse that you have written , but none of them have explained  HOW  a dead man can than understand as referenced in 1 Cor 2:14 .

 

I think you are mistaken.  Jesus died for all men.  All men have been made alive in Christ.  His grace has appeared to all men.

Now what?

Will you follow or reject his grace?

[mark s]

I think we need to use a correct definition of death.

If we say, "dead people can't respond", what is that based on?

This seems to me to presuppose that death involves the cessation of activity.  However, I think that is erroneously based what death looks like in the temporal realm.

In Revelation 20, "the dead" "stand" before the great white throne.  Jesus spoke of people who had died, yet were interacting with each other, in Luke 16.  Samuel the prophet, though dead, interacted with King Saul.  There are other examples.

Spiritually speaking, to those who are born again, we are dead to our flesh, yet our flesh remains active.

I think the only definition of "death" that fits in all respects the Biblical usage is "separation".  Physical death is separation of the soul from the body.  Spiritual death is the separation of the soul from God.  Our death in Christ separates us from the fallen flesh, even as we are recreated a new spiritual creation.

If we define death as inactivity, we will reach incorrect conclusions.

And, of course, there is the passage already mentioned, "all will be made alive in Christ".  Some call this "prevenient grace".

Love in Christ,
Mark

[dan p]

 Hi to you , and Paul means  dead in trespasses and sins or spiritually dead as 1  Cor 2:14 , because  they are spiritually discerned .