The Thing I Greatly Feared

[gospel]

Well Adam and Eve had no sin in them as well but the Devil tempted them in the (Garden).They had nothing in them at that point.Sin entered in through Adam

Now in the (wilderness) Jesus was tempted for 40 days and spent time with the devil and the wild beasts and as we can see it wasn't a walk in the park.
11 Then the devil left Him, and behold, angels came and ministered to Him.
Matt 4:10-11 (NKJV)

Jesus the Man was tempted like Adam the Man but he overcame proving to us all that he really is the MAN.

Here we go again!


I can't believe you folks do not understand the difference between the two and would continue to actually compare Adam and Eve to Jesus...wow!

Jesus, God the Son came to repair the damage, fix the mess Adam and Eve made

No comparison!

Jesus is Lord, Savior

Adam and Eve were not

Jesus is God come down from heaven

Adam was a being God made from out of the earth


The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven. 1 Corinthians 15:47


"The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all. John 3:31

Everyone of you keeps circling back to the same 2-3 things, Hebrews 4:15, the Garden of Eden and Luke 4  

"For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.. Hebrews 4:15

You wrongly take this to mean Jesus was tempted within Himself, when it is not saying that He had the weakness of being tempted.

For instance if someone asks you to rob a bank and tells you they have a full proof plan for getting away with it...

They are in fact tempting you...BUT

It is not a temptation for you unless that is something you have considered doing or wanted to do

Their offer would be tempting to you ONLY if you it were something that enticed you, that you considered or always wanted to do.

Otherwise you'd just tell them to get out of your face....like Jesus told Satan

Get out of my face, get behind me, you need to follow me, because you can't lead me to do anything!

Jesus is God, God cannot be tempted!

Jesus is not like Adam and Eve who were earthly made from the earth and not Perfect

Jesus allowed Satan to try to tempt Him, according to scripture He had no problem, no struggle whatsoever saying no to Satan at any point

And that is because Jesus is Perfect

[Thankfulldad]

Well Adam and Eve had no sin in them as well but the Devil tempted them in the (Garden).They had nothing in them at that point.Sin entered in through Adam

Now in the (wilderness) Jesus was tempted for 40 days and spent time with the devil and the wild beasts and as we can see it wasn't a walk in the park.
11 Then the devil left Him, and behold, angels came and ministered to Him.
Matt 4:10-11 (NKJV)

Jesus the Man was tempted like Adam the Man but he overcame proving to us all that he really is the MAN.

Here we go again!


I can't believe you folks do not understand the difference and would continue to actually compare Adam and Eve to Jesus...wow!


The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven. 1 Corinthians 15:47


"The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all. John 3:31

Everyone of you keeps circling back to the same 2-3 things, Hebrews 4:15, the Garden of Eden and Luke 4   

"For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.. Hebrews 4:15

You wrongly take this to mean Jesus was tempted within Himself, when it is not saying that He had the weakness of being tempted.

For instance if someone asks you to rob a bank and tells you they have a full proof plan for getting away with it...

They are in fact tempting you...BUT

It is not a temptation for you unless that is something you have considered doing or wanted to do

Their offer would be tempting to you ONLY if you it were something that enticed you, that you considered or always wanted to do.

Otherwise you'd just tell them to get out of your face....like Jesus told Satan

Get out of my face, get behind me, you need to follow me, because you can't lead me to do anything!

Jesus is God, God cannot be tempted!

Jesus is not like Adam and Eve who were earthly made from the earth and not Perfect

Jesus allowed Satan to try to tempt Him, according to scripture He had no problem, no struggle whatsoever saying no to Satan at any point

And that is because Jesus is Perfect

Makes perfect sense to me

[bemark]

16 For indeed He does not give aid to angels, but He does give aid to the seed of Abraham. 17 Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. 18 For in that He Himself has suffered, being tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.
Heb 2:16-18 (NKJV)

[Bitter Sweet]

16 For indeed He does not give aid to angels, but He does give aid to the seed of Abraham. 17 Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. 18 For in that He Himself has suffered, being tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.
Heb 2:16-18 (NKJV)

You also made a really good point about Adam and Eve, totally forgot they were without sin too.

[gospel]

Well Adam and Eve had no sin in them as well but the Devil tempted them in the (Garden).They had nothing in them at that point.Sin entered in through Adam

Now in the (wilderness) Jesus was tempted for 40 days and spent time with the devil and the wild beasts and as we can see it wasn't a walk in the park.
11 Then the devil left Him, and behold, angels came and ministered to Him.
Matt 4:10-11 (NKJV)

Jesus the Man was tempted like Adam the Man but he overcame proving to us all that he really is the MAN.

Here we go again!


I can't believe you folks do not understand the difference and would continue to actually compare Adam and Eve to Jesus...wow!


The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven. 1 Corinthians 15:47


"The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all. John 3:31

Everyone of you keeps circling back to the same 2-3 things, Hebrews 4:15, the Garden of Eden and Luke 4   

"For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.. Hebrews 4:15

You wrongly take this to mean Jesus was tempted within Himself, when it is not saying that He had the weakness of being tempted.

For instance if someone asks you to rob a bank and tells you they have a full proof plan for getting away with it...

They are in fact tempting you...BUT

It is not a temptation for you unless that is something you have considered doing or wanted to do

Their offer would be tempting to you ONLY if you it were something that enticed you, that you considered or always wanted to do.

Otherwise you'd just tell them to get out of your face....like Jesus told Satan

Get out of my face, get behind me, you need to follow me, because you can't lead me to do anything!

Jesus is God, God cannot be tempted!

Jesus is not like Adam and Eve who were earthly made from the earth and not Perfect

Jesus allowed Satan to try to tempt Him, according to scripture He had no problem, no struggle whatsoever saying no to Satan at any point

And that is because Jesus is Perfect

Makes perfect sense to me

Thanks Thankful  

Funny thing about it in a sad kind of way is...

Jesus Created Adam and Eve...yet these folks still attempt to compare them to Him

So when I see these kinds of comments

I have to admit I am somewhat aghast and dismayed


New American Standard Bible (©1995)
All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being. John 1:3

For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. Colossians 1:16

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. Genesis 1:26

JESUS IS GOD!

[bemark]

But then we have this passage as well

16 For indeed He does not give aid to angels, but He does give aid to the seed of Abraham. 17 Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. 18 For in that He Himself has suffered, being tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.
Heb 2:16-18 (NKJV)

[gospel]

16 For indeed He does not give aid to angels, but He does give aid to the seed of Abraham. 17 Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. 18 For in that He Himself has suffered, being tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.
Heb 2:16-18 (NKJV)

You also made a really good point about Adam and Eve, totally forgot they were without sin too.

Bittersweet, if I am correct, you've stated you're married to an atheist and have stated he doesn't lust after woman

Yet you want to believe my Jesus did

Johndb said he doesn't lust after woman

Yet he wants to believe my Jesus did

You, me, Johndb, his wife, bemark, Thankfuldad, larry2 and every human being on planet earth born on planet earth is like Adam and Eve

earthly and as such flawed and imperfect

Jesus is from heaven

PERFECT!

Egads the level of this conversation is staggeringly frustrating

when I see the lack of understanding BELIEVERS have in the knowledge of Our Lord and Savior

YET WITHOUT SIN

Means there was no sin found in Him

In the wilderness
Satan was looking for sin in Jesus .....GOT FRUSTRATED cause He couldn't find any!  

John 14:30

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
"I will not speak much more with you, for the ruler of the world is coming, and he has nothing in Me;

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.

International Standard Version (©2008)
I will not talk with you much longer, because the ruler of this world is coming. He has no power over me.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
"After this I will not be speaking much with you, for The Prince of the world is coming and he has nothing to use against me.


THERE WAS NO SIN IN JESUS!

[Wycliffes_Shillelagh]

Funny thing about it in a sad kind of way is...

Jesus Created Adam and Eve...yet these folks still attempt to compare them to Him

So when I see these kinds of comments

I have to admit I am somewhat aghast and dismayed

Here's a particularly bad one of those comparisons...

Rom 5:14-15 - Death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.  But not as the offence, so also [is] the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, [which is] by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

[gospel]

But then we have this passage as well

16 For indeed He does not give aid to angels, but He does give aid to the seed of Abraham. 17 Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. 18 For in that He Himself has suffered, being tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.
Heb 2:16-18 (NKJV)

Bemark think about what you're doing

You're trying to prove that Jesus could have sinned just like you and I

What in the heck kind of thing is that to prove?

That's like agreeing with JWs and Muslims that Jesus was just a man...

Somehow you folks are missing that

You can't say Jesus is God

And then turnaround and say God could have sinned because He was just like us

That's why a lot of people don't respect Christians

You folks act like you don't understand your own bible and your own Faith

JESUS IS GOD

Everything begins and ends right there

You're so caught up making God like us

You overlook the fact that the reason He came was to do with man could not do

SAVE OURSELVES

Luke 18:27 Jesus replied, "What is impossible with men is possible with God.

[Bitter Sweet]

Bittersweet, if I am correct, you've stated you're married to an atheist and have stated he doesn't lust after woman

Yet you want to believe my Jesus did

Johndb said he doesn't lust after woman

Yet he wants to believe my Jesus did

That's borderline slander because we never said we believe Jesus had lust in his heart, you are the only one saying it. I said my husband doesn't have an issue with that and John doesn't have an issue with it either.

You are bearing false witness against us, there is a commandment that states not to do that.

[gospel]

Funny thing about it in a sad kind of way is...

Jesus Created Adam and Eve...yet these folks still attempt to compare them to Him

So when I see these kinds of comments

I have to admit I am somewhat aghast and dismayed

Here's a particularly bad one of those comparisons...

Rom 5:14-15 - Death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.  But not as the offence, so also [is] the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, [which is] by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

Maybe you're being sarcastic but in assuming you are not

The comparison Paul is making in that verse

THE EXTENT OF HOW MUCH BETTER JESUS IS THAN ADAM

I suppose now we'll be digressing to argue that Jesus is just like Adam

But I need to remind you

JESUS CREATED ADAM!

[Wycliffes_Shillelagh]

I suppose now we'll be digressing to argue that Jesus is just like Adam

But I need to remind you

JESUS CREATED ADAM!

Yep... in His own image.  Adam was just like Jesus.

Jarrod

[gospel]

Bittersweet, if I am correct, you've stated you're married to an atheist and have stated he doesn't lust after woman

Yet you want to believe my Jesus did

Johndb said he doesn't lust after woman

Yet he wants to believe my Jesus did

That's borderline slander because we never said we believe Jesus had lust in his heart, you are the only one saying it. I said my husband doesn't have an issue with that and John doesn't have an issue with it either.

Not meaning to be slanderous but you're saying we, as if you all agree and I'm directing my comments at everyone who has been debating against my points

So what has been said is

JESUS HAD THE CAPACITY TO SIN

That is exactly the same as saying

JESUS HAD SIN WITHIN HIM

Your husband has sin in him and is choosing not to sin

Johndb has sin in him and is choosing not to sin

JESUS HAD NO SIN IN HIM

Why?

The bible makes it clear

John 14:30

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
"I will not speak much more with you, for the ruler of the world is coming, and he has nothing in Me;

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.


1 John 2:16
For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life, is not from the Father, but is from the world.


God cannot be tempted!


13 Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God

[Wycliffes_Shillelagh]

So what has been said is

JESUS HAD THE CAPACITY TO SIN

That is exactly the same as saying

JESUS HAD SIN WITHIN HIM

See, here's the crux of what's wrong with your theology here.  Those two things are not at all the same.  Not remotely similar, even.

[Bitter Sweet]

We are carried away by our own lusts

THAT MEANS

YOU HAVE TO HAVE LUST WITHIN YOU TO BE TEMPTED

NO LUST, NO DESIRE, NO ENTICEMENT..... NO TEMPTATION, its that simple!

That's My Lord and Savior Jesus Perfect in Every way!

Some of us don't have an issue with lust, desire, enticement, or temptation. We learned how to be in control over it from Jesus. How can he teach us how to do it if he himself didn't know how?

[Thankfulldad]

Some of us don't have an issue with lust, desire, enticement, or temptation. We learned how to be in control over it from Jesus. How can he teach us how to do it if he himself didn't know how?

Really...no desire of sin or temptation?  When is the last time you were tempted?

[gospel]

So what has been said is

JESUS HAD THE CAPACITY TO SIN

That is exactly the same as saying

JESUS HAD SIN WITHIN HIM

See, here's the crux of what's wrong with your theology here.  Those two things are not at all the same.  Not remotely similar, even.

Jarrod get yourself some scripture pardner!

Human wisdom ain't gonna cut it round these parts

They are EXACTLY the same

JESUS WAS UNABLE TO SIN

because

THERE WAS NO SIN WITHIN HIM

-----

PURE WATER HAS NO CAPACITY TO POISON

because

PURE WATER HAS NO POISON IN IT


same thing

[Bitter Sweet]

Some of us don't have an issue with lust, desire, enticement, or temptation. We learned how to be in control over it from Jesus. How can he teach us how to do it if he himself didn't know how?

Really...no desire of sin or temptation?  When is the last time you were tempted?

None, no desire. I can't remember the last time, there isn't anything in this world that I desire to be tempted by.

[bemark]

But that is where he tricked the trickster.

He defeated him where we didn't so through him we could have victory.

He became like us so we can become like him.


We are talking in what form was Jesus in on earth.Did he bleed and did he not get angry and not sin.Did he not weep eat and sleep.

Look he came  from above to come down and then he went  up again.

[gospel]

But that is where he tricked the trickster.

He defeated him where we didn't so through him we could have victory.

He became like us so we can become like him.


We are talking in what form was Jesus in on earth.Did he bleed and did he not get angry and not sin.Did he not weep eat and sleep.

Look he came  from above to come down and then he went  up again.

Scripture please?

[bemark]

What part.

[Thankfulldad]

Some of us don't have an issue with lust, desire, enticement, or temptation. We learned how to be in control over it from Jesus. How can he teach us how to do it if he himself didn't know how?

Really...no desire of sin or temptation?  When is the last time you were tempted?

None, no desire. I can't remember the last time, there isn't anything in this world that I desire to be tempted by.

No lust? No anger? No judging others? No coveting? No envy? Nothing?  You love perfectly...always patient, always kind, never envy, never boast, never proud, never rude, never self-seeking, not easily angered, you keep no record of wrongs, you never lie or deceive, always trusting, always protecting, always hoping  No temptations of this world what so ever?  You always show compassion, forgive all...would give up your life for another?  You are honestly never tempted by anything in this world, by satan or by your own flesh?

Amazing...

Satan, his demon buddies, my flesh and this world; are a constant battle in my life tempting me...causing me to struggle, stumble and so on

[gospel]

What part.

You're arguing that Purity had within Himself impurity ....

I'm arguing there is no impurity in Jesus

He was Perfectly Pure in every way

Satan found nothing of his stuff in Jesus because there was nothing that belonged to Satan in Jesus

John 14:30

If you disagree cite a scripture that contradicts John 14:30

Show us in scripture where deceit is found in the heart or mouth of Jesus

It's literally like saying pure water has to be tested for poison

Actually kind of silly

[gospel]

Some of us don't have an issue with lust, desire, enticement, or temptation. We learned how to be in control over it from Jesus. How can he teach us how to do it if he himself didn't know how?

Really...no desire of sin or temptation?  When is the last time you were tempted?

None, no desire. I can't remember the last time, there isn't anything in this world that I desire to be tempted by.

No lust? No anger? No judging others? No coveting? No envy? Nothing?  You love perfectly...always patient, always kind, never envy, never boast, never proud, never rude, never self-seeking, not easily angered, you keep no record of wrongs, you never lie or deceive, always trusting, always protecting, always hoping  No temptations of this world what so ever?  You always show compassion, forgive all...would give up your life for another?  You are honestly never tempted by anything in this world, by satan or by your own flesh?

Amazing...

Satan, his demon buddies, my flesh and this world; are a constant battle in my life tempting me...causing me to struggle, stumble and so on

Yep....its Ephesians 6:12, everyday!

[Wycliffes_Shillelagh]

So what has been said is

JESUS HAD THE CAPACITY TO SIN

That is exactly the same as saying

JESUS HAD SIN WITHIN HIM

See, here's the crux of what's wrong with your theology here.  Those two things are not at all the same.  Not remotely similar, even.

Jarrod get yourself some scripture pardner!

Human wisdom ain't gonna cut it round these parts

They are EXACTLY the same

JESUS WAS UNABLE TO SIN

because

THERE WAS NO SIN WITHIN HIM

I don't see much use in plying you with the same Scriptures over and over again, just so you can ignore them.  My interest in arguing with you is slim, since you use every logical fallacy and rhetorical trick known to man, ignore any sort of real argument, and just pound the same point over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

My comment was just an observation, to point out to others where the train left the tracks and went hurdling through the bushes.

Jesus was fully man, as well as fully God, regardless of how often you try to deny it.

Jarrod

[bemark]

I agree he had nothing in him

Nor did Adam.

Jesus didn't sin and that's what counts.Why did the devil even attempt to tempt Jesus,  because he must have known him for a long time before hand.

Known his nature.

[Supplanter]

What part.

You're arguing that Purity had within Himself impurity ....

I'm arguing there is no impurity in Jesus

He was Perfectly Pure in every way

Satan found nothing of his stuff in Jesus because there was nothing that belonged to Satan in Jesus

John 14:30

If you disagree cite a scripture that contradicts John 14:30

Show us in scripture where deceit is found in the heart or mouth of Jesus

It's literally like saying pure water has to be tested for poison

Actually kind of silly

Yes, but is it not possible to poison that pure water? That would be the analogy we are speaking of and not that it isn't pure to begin or that it didn't stay pure, just that any water can be poisoned if we choose to put poison in it.

[Bitter Sweet]

No lust? No anger? No judging others? No coveting? No envy? Nothing?  You love perfectly...always patient, always kind, never envy, never boast, never proud, never rude, never self-seeking, not easily angered, you keep no record of wrongs, you never lie or deceive, always trusting, always protecting, always hoping  No temptations of this world what so ever?  You always show compassion, forgive all...would give up your life for another?  You are honestly never tempted by anything in this world, by satan or by your own flesh?

I'm not  perfect, I do correct myself when I make a mistake but the biggies I don't have any issues with. I don't hold what people say to me against them, I am constantly attempting to make peace with people. Perfection isn't easily put into words, knowing that we are imperfect and make a constant effort to be more perfect is what matters. Also believing you know exactly what perfection is, could that make you perfect? No, because perfection isn't what most people imagine it to be, that's why it's always within our reach.

I don't know what to be tempted by? I don't see anything of that much interest to me out there. The world bores me.

Satan, his demon buddies, my flesh and this world; are a constant battle in my life tempting me...causing me to struggle, stumble and so on

If it doesn't go against your will and you truly want to do God's will then you won't have a problem with this for much longer.

[Jimmy]

This is just one more of those discussions that derive basically from the false teaching of original sin.  That one false doctrine has probably generated more subsequent false teachings within Christendom than any one other of Satan's lies.

[Insight]

The thread of confusion is what is found here.  Stand back and take a macro view of this topic and see how Trinitarian/Demonic doctrine is holding all back from seeing God's view of our inherited sin-prone nature.

The palaver of devil talk is also an issue.

Why do you think Job greatly feared God (and not some imaginary supernatural being)?
The answer is obvious!

[bemark]

could you please expand on this so i can get your point or points

[Insight]

could you please expand on this so i can get your point or points

We know there is no such thing as an evil supernatural being; only an adversary of Job whose complaint had come up to God.

Why do you think Job greatly feared God?

The answer is in the record!

[bemark]

What about satan and the 1/3 that was cast out of heaven.

Now Job greatly feared God because he met him in the cloud of Darkness and lets be real only Moses wanted to go up the first time.

The Knowledge of the  fear of God is the beginning of understanding.Yeah the love of God is good and also the peace of God but to come into the knowledge of him in this way must have blown his mind.Big Daddy now asking some hard questions.

Because he wanted Job to know him more,  so he could be known more to Job.Penetrating questions right through the soul like a hot  knife through butter.The sword of the Lord

[Insight]

No so whats the problem

Do me a favour Bemark.

What Bible program do you use?

[bemark]

You must have a concern.What is it?