Pentecost

[winsome]

Catholics celebrate Pentecost - but not very much.  Apparently we used to have an octave of Pentecost until 1969 when it was dropped

I read an article recently that hinted that Orthodox make more of the feast.

How do the Orthodox celebrate Pentecost?

[CDHealy]

Pentecost is one of the 12 major feasts of the Church.  It is the culmination of the 50-day Paschal season, and has special prayers and hymns associated with the day.  Pentecost is also known for the "kneeling prayers" in which a triad of lengthy prayers, prayed while kneeling, marks the day.

It is also a day appropriate for baptisms and chrismations (anointing with holy oil, or chrism, for reception into the Orthodox Church, where a triune immersion has already taken place).  My own chrismation was on Pentecost 2007.

[winsome]

Interesting.

In the Catholic Church I suppose Pentecost is the culmination of the 50 day season of Easteride in the sense that it is the last day of Eastertide. It is a Feast day but we don't seem to make much of it (except for the charismatics).

Baptisms & Confirmations take place round the year, except for adult reception into the Church which tend to takle place at Easter.

[DaveW]

In the Catholic Church I suppose Pentecost is the culmination of the 50 day season of Easteride in the sense that it is the last day of Eastertide. It is a Feast day but we don't seem to make much of it (except for the charismatics)

Growing up pentecostal, my best friend was catholic and he thought it quite strange that his church celebrated Pentecost and a pentecostal church did not.

Now (as a Messianic) Shavuot (feast of weeks) / Pentecost (50 count) is celebrated and counting the omer from the sabbath after Pesach (the passover seder) is strongly encouraged. 

BTW today is day 38.

[DaveW]

Today is the 40th day of the Omer, probable day of the Asention.

BTW - this year the 2 systems of counting the Omer (originated by the Pharasees and Sadducees) coincide since the 15th of Abib/Nisan was on a Saturday.

The Sadducean, followed by Karaites and some Messianic Jews always starts the count on Sunday (the day following the Saturday sabbath) where the Pharasaic formula followed by Ashkenazic and Sephardic Jews (rabbinic Judaism) starts the count on Nisan 16 no matter what day of the week it falls on, since the 15th is also called a sabbath.

Lev 23.15  You shall also count for yourselves from the day after the sabbath, from the day when you brought in the sheaf of the wave offering; there shall be seven complete sabbaths.
16 You shall count fifty days to the day after the seventh sabbath; then you shall present a new grain offering to the Lord.

ETA:  "Seven sabbaths" literally means "seven sevens" and can also be translated seven weeks. The words for "Sabbath" (day of rest), the number "seven" and "week" are all very close, virtually interchangable. Hence the confusion.  In our synagogue we follow the Sadducean/Karaite system which intreprets the phrase as seven (Saturday) sabbaths.

[winsome]

A couple of years ago the Catholic Bishops of England and Wales decided to shift the celebration of the Ascension from the Thursday (today) to the following Sunday. Personally I regret this.

[DaveW]

What was their justification?  The scripture says the Omer count was 40, not 43.

[winsome]

What was their justification?  The scripture says the Omer count was 40, not 43.

The reasoning was that the Ascension is a very important feast. Relatively few people were going because it was midweek, Shifting the celebration to the Sunday when most Catholics were going to Mass anyway meant that many more people celebrated it.

This was not some new innovation by the Bishops of England and Wales. Some countries (I don't know how many) were celebrating Ascension on Sunday already.

[DaveW]

That does not really make sense.  I see nothing in scripture that tries to make celebrations "convienient." Of the 3 pilgrim holidays, 2 were at least 7 days each, had to be celebrated away from home and came in the middle of planting (unleavened bread) and harvest (feast of tabernacles) seasons.

Day 41.
Blessed are You, O Lord our God, who sanctifies us by the commandments and has commanded us concerning counting the omer.

[winsome]

That does not really make sense.  I see nothing in scripture that tries to make celebrations "convienient." Of the 3 pilgrim holidays, 2 were at least 7 days each, had to be celebrated away from home and came in the middle of planting (unleavened bread) and harvest (feast of tabernacles) seasons.

Day 41.
Blessed are You, O Lord our God, who sanctifies us by the commandments and has commanded us concerning counting the omer.

I would prefer to celebrate the Ascension on the Thursday but as to the pilgim holidays, these are OT festivals. We do not celebrate OT festivals. We celebrate Pentecost because that is when the Holy Spirit fell on the assembled Church. We celebrate it as a NT feast day.

[DaveW]

Not my point at all.

My point was that God has appointed times, and they are not always convienient.  Does Paul not say they are all examples for us in the New Covenant?  We should not be in the business of trying to make them convienient.

BTW - in our tradition we DO celebrate those feasts.

[DaveW]

Happy Shavuot/Feast of Weeks/Pentecost Everyone!!!

[winsome]

Happy Shavuot/Feast of Weeks/Pentecost Everyone!!!

Indeed