Why do bad things happen to good people?

[Lively Stone]

You proved what I said, we are not appointed to die. It is true God can take us for whatever reason, but there isn't a point in time where we will die because it is preordained.

Jesus was the only one ever appointed to die.

Hebrews 9:27-28
And just as surely as it is appointed for all men to die and after that pass to their judgment, so it is certain that Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many and after that, to those who look for him, he will appear a second time, not this time to deal with sin, but to bring them to full salvation.

[Nevertheless]

In Genesis 15:13, God tells Abraham, "Know that your descendents are going to be enslaved in a land they don't know," which of course ends up being Egypt.

This was a punishment to Abraham for going to Egypt against God's wishes.

Nowhere does God either state or imply that this is a punishment for anything. It is simply a declaration of what will happen. God is not shy about telling people what they've done wrong or what a punishment is for. If He was punishing Abram He would have said so.

Once again, we need to look at the context.

7 And he said to him, "I am the Lord who brought you out from Ur of the Chaldeans to give you this land to possess." 8 But he said, "O Lord God, how am I to know that I shall possess it?" 9 He said to him, "Bring me a heifer three years old, a female goat three years old, a ram three years old, a turtledove, and a young pigeon." 10 And he brought him all these, cut them in half, and laid each half over against the other. But he did not cut the birds in half. 11 And when birds of prey came down on the carcasses, Abram drove them away.

12 As the sun was going down, a deep sleep fell on Abram. And behold, dreadful and great darkness fell upon him. 13 Then the Lord said to Abram, "Know for certain that your offspring will be sojourners in a land that is not theirs and will be servants there, and they will be afflicted for four hundred years. 14 But I will bring judgment on the nation that they serve, and afterward they shall come out with great possessions. 15 As for you, you shall go to your fathers in peace; you shall be buried in a good old age. 16 And they shall come back here in the fourth generation, for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet complete."

God's statement in vs.13 and following is a direct response to Abram's question in vs. 8, and follows the statement that Abram believed God and He counted it as righteousness.

Let's not read things into Scripture.

[HRoberson]

To paraphrase an ancient, Middle-Eastern rabbi: "Crap happens."


That's why bad things happen to good people.

[Funguy33]

To paraphrase an ancient, Middle-Eastern rabbi: "Crap happens."


That's why bad things happen to good people.

Nothing in life is luck of the draw or coincidence... Read Deuteronomy 28 or Leviticus 26

Lamintations 3:32-33 says all evil comes only from God as a punishment for sin.

[Funguy33]

In Genesis 15:13, God tells Abraham, "Know that your descendents are going to be enslaved in a land they don't know," which of course ends up being Egypt.

This was a punishment to Abraham for going to Egypt against God's wishes.

Nowhere does God either state or imply that this is a punishment for anything. It is simply a declaration of what will happen. God is not shy about telling people what they've done wrong or what a punishment is for. If He was punishing Abram He would have said so.

Once again, we need to look at the context.

7 And he said to him, "I am the Lord who brought you out from Ur of the Chaldeans to give you this land to possess." 8 But he said, "O Lord God, how am I to know that I shall possess it?" 9 He said to him, "Bring me a heifer three years old, a female goat three years old, a ram three years old, a turtledove, and a young pigeon." 10 And he brought him all these, cut them in half, and laid each half over against the other. But he did not cut the birds in half. 11 And when birds of prey came down on the carcasses, Abram drove them away.

12 As the sun was going down, a deep sleep fell on Abram. And behold, dreadful and great darkness fell upon him. 13 Then the Lord said to Abram, "Know for certain that your offspring will be sojourners in a land that is not theirs and will be servants there, and they will be afflicted for four hundred years. 14 But I will bring judgment on the nation that they serve, and afterward they shall come out with great possessions. 15 As for you, you shall go to your fathers in peace; you shall be buried in a good old age. 16 And they shall come back here in the fourth generation, for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet complete."

God's statement in vs.13 and following is a direct response to Abram's question in vs. 8, and follows the statement that Abram believed God and He counted it as righteousness.

Let's not read things into Scripture.

When Abraham left Egypt, he brought Hagar and changed the history of the world.
Everything we do has a forever consequence, good or bad.

[MeMyself]

In Genesis 15:13, God tells Abraham, "Know that your descendents are going to be enslaved in a land they don't know," which of course ends up being Egypt.

This was a punishment to Abraham for going to Egypt against God's wishes.

Nowhere does God either state or imply that this is a punishment for anything. It is simply a declaration of what will happen. God is not shy about telling people what they've done wrong or what a punishment is for. If He was punishing Abram He would have said so.

Once again, we need to look at the context.

7 And he said to him, "I am the Lord who brought you out from Ur of the Chaldeans to give you this land to possess." 8 But he said, "O Lord God, how am I to know that I shall possess it?" 9 He said to him, "Bring me a heifer three years old, a female goat three years old, a ram three years old, a turtledove, and a young pigeon." 10 And he brought him all these, cut them in half, and laid each half over against the other. But he did not cut the birds in half. 11 And when birds of prey came down on the carcasses, Abram drove them away.

12 As the sun was going down, a deep sleep fell on Abram. And behold, dreadful and great darkness fell upon him. 13 Then the Lord said to Abram, "Know for certain that your offspring will be sojourners in a land that is not theirs and will be servants there, and they will be afflicted for four hundred years. 14 But I will bring judgment on the nation that they serve, and afterward they shall come out with great possessions. 15 As for you, you shall go to your fathers in peace; you shall be buried in a good old age. 16 And they shall come back here in the fourth generation, for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet complete."

God's statement in vs.13 and following is a direct response to Abram's question in vs. 8, and follows the statement that Abram believed God and He counted it as righteousness.

Let's not read things into Scripture.

When Abraham left Egypt, he brought Hagar and changed the history of the world.
Everything we do has a forever consequence, good or bad.

that doesn't change the fact that you are misapplying scripture (using it out of context) to make ridiculous claims

[Nevertheless]

Everything we do has a forever consequence, good or bad.

Finally! A true statement!

[Nevertheless]

Lamintations 3:32-33 says all evil comes only from God as a punishment for sin.

It says nothing of the kind.

31  For the Lord will not
    cast off forever,
32 but, though he cause grief, he will have compassion
     according to the abundance of his steadfast love;
33  for he does not afflict from his heart
    or grieve the children of men.

31 For no one is abandoned
    by the Lord forever.
32 Though he brings grief, he also shows compassion
    because of the greatness of his unfailing love.
33 For he does not enjoy hurting people
    or causing them sorrow.

Funguy, when are you going to quit making these wildly inaccurate statements?

[Funguy33]

Lamintations 3:32-33 says all evil comes only from God as a punishment for sin.

It says nothing of the kind.

31  For the Lord will not
    cast off forever,
32 but, though he cause grief, he will have compassion
     according to the abundance of his steadfast love;
33  for he does not afflict from his heart
    or grieve the children of men.

31 For no one is abandoned
    by the Lord forever.
32 Though he brings grief, he also shows compassion
    because of the greatness of his unfailing love.
33 For he does not enjoy hurting people
    or causing them sorrow.

Funguy, when are you going to quit making these wildly inaccurate statements?

The whole Book of Lamintations is about God's punishment for sin.

Moses was not allowed into the Promised Land and caused the people to wander 40 years,  because of his unbelief.
His family was never used by God again.

[Nevertheless]

Lamintations 3:32-33 says all evil comes only from God as a punishment for sin.

The whole Book of Lamintations is about God's punishment for sin.

These are two very different statements, and the second does not validate the first.

Moses was not allowed into the Promised Land and caused the people to wander 40 years,  because of his unbelief.
His family was never used by God again.

Three more wildly inaccurate statements.

Moses was denied entry into the promised land for disrespect,(not treatling God as holy) not unbelief.

48 That very day the Lord spoke to Moses, 49 "Go up this mountain of the Abarim, Mount Nebo, which is in the land of Moab, opposite Jericho, and view the land of Canaan, which I am giving to the people of Israel for a possession. 50 And die on the mountain which you go up, and be gathered to your people, as Aaron your brother died in Mount Hor and was gathered to his people, 51 because you broke faith with me in the midst of the people of Israel at the waters of Meribah-kadesh, in the wilderness of Zin, and because you did not treat me as holy in the midst of the people of Israel. 52 For you shall see the land before you, but you shall not go there, into the land that I am giving to the people of Israel."

Moses did not cause the people to wander for 40 years, that was their own fault.

20 Then the Lord said, "I have pardoned, according to your word. 21 But truly, as I live, and as all the earth shall be filled with the glory of the Lord, 22  none of the men who have seen my glory and my signs that I did in Egypt and in the wilderness, and yet have put me to the test these ten times and have not obeyed my voice, 23  shall see the land that I swore to give to their fathers. And none of those who despised me shall see it.

Moses' family was used by God. Moses' nephews (Aaron's sons) were the first high priests. The two eldest, Nadab & Abihu, God used mightily to teach the Israelites respect for the Law. (See Numbers 26)

[HRoberson]

To paraphrase an ancient, Middle-Eastern rabbi: "Crap happens."


That's why bad things happen to good people.

Nothing in life is luck of the draw or coincidence... Read Deuteronomy 28 or Leviticus 26

Lamintations 3:32-33 says all evil comes only from God as a punishment for sin.

Yeah well, I got my information from the guy that inspired those passages. You'd think he'd know better, huh?

[Wycliffes_Shillelagh]

Question: Why do bad things happen to good people?

Answer: Proximity to bad people.

[Funguy33]

To paraphrase an ancient, Middle-Eastern rabbi: "Crap happens."


That's why bad things happen to good people.

Nothing in life is luck of the draw or coincidence... Read Deuteronomy 28 or Leviticus 26

Lamintations 3:32-33 says all evil comes only from God as a punishment for sin.

Yeah well, I got my information from the guy that inspired those passages. You'd think he'd know better, huh?

So, you are saying, you don't need to read the Bible because Jesus tells you everything you need to know?

How does Jesus interpret Exodus 34:7 or does He tell you to use white-out?

God thought this message was so important, He repeated it 5 times.

[Funguy33]

Lamintations 3:32-33 says all evil comes only from God as a punishment for sin.

The whole Book of Lamintations is about God's punishment for sin.

These are two very different statements, and the second does not validate the first.

Moses was not allowed into the Promised Land and caused the people to wander 40 years,  because of his unbelief.
His family was never used by God again.

Three more wildly inaccurate statements.

Moses was denied entry into the promised land for disrespect,(not treatling God as holy) not unbelief.

48 That very day the Lord spoke to Moses, 49 "Go up this mountain of the Abarim, Mount Nebo, which is in the land of Moab, opposite Jericho, and view the land of Canaan, which I am giving to the people of Israel for a possession. 50 And die on the mountain which you go up, and be gathered to your people, as Aaron your brother died in Mount Hor and was gathered to his people, 51 because you broke faith with me in the midst of the people of Israel at the waters of Meribah-kadesh, in the wilderness of Zin, and because you did not treat me as holy in the midst of the people of Israel. 52 For you shall see the land before you, but you shall not go there, into the land that I am giving to the people of Israel."

Moses did not cause the people to wander for 40 years, that was their own fault.

20 Then the Lord said, "I have pardoned, according to your word. 21 But truly, as I live, and as all the earth shall be filled with the glory of the Lord, 22  none of the men who have seen my glory and my signs that I did in Egypt and in the wilderness, and yet have put me to the test these ten times and have not obeyed my voice, 23  shall see the land that I swore to give to their fathers. And none of those who despised me shall see it.

Moses' family was used by God. Moses' nephews (Aaron's sons) were the first high priests. The two eldest, Nadab & Abihu, God used mightily to teach the Israelites respect for the Law. (See Numbers 26)

Moses knew 40 years before the rock hitting he wasn't going. Numbers 14:30

Deuteronomy 1: 19- 45 Moses tried to pass the blame to others.

[Nevertheless]

Moses knew 40 years before the rock hitting he wasn't going. Numbers 14:30

Numbers 14 was not 40 years before Moses hit the rock. 40 years before that error Moses was "getting out of Dodge" because he had murdered an Egyptian.

Deuteronomy 1: 19- 45 Moses tried to pass the blame to others.

No, he is simply giving a factual account of the events that occurred. Moses actually pleaded with God for the people when they refused to enter the land God had promised. You referred to Numbers 14, maybe you should go back and read what it says.

[Funguy33]

Moses knew 40 years before the rock hitting he wasn't going. Numbers 14:30

Numbers 14 was not 40 years before Moses hit the rock. 40 years before that error Moses was "getting out of Dodge" because he had murdered an Egyptian.

Deuteronomy 1: 19- 45 Moses tried to pass the blame to others.

No, he is simply giving a factual account of the events that occurred. Moses actually pleaded with God for the people when they refused to enter the land God had promised. You referred to Numbers 14, maybe you should go back and read what it says.

Moses hit the miracle rock which followed them all the time they traveled, instead of speaking to it after Miriam died...Numbers 20:11

They had to wander 40 years as punishment, because it was 40 days that Moses sent spies,  instead of going directly into Israel.

[HRoberson]

To paraphrase an ancient, Middle-Eastern rabbi: "Crap happens."


That's why bad things happen to good people.

Nothing in life is luck of the draw or coincidence... Read Deuteronomy 28 or Leviticus 26

Lamintations 3:32-33 says all evil comes only from God as a punishment for sin.

Yeah well, I got my information from the guy that inspired those passages. You'd think he'd know better, huh?

So, you are saying, you don't need to read the Bible because Jesus tells you everything you need to know?

How does Jesus interpret Exodus 34:7 or does He tell you to use white-out?

God thought this message was so important, He repeated it 5 times.

have you read the NT? I don't mean your favorite proof texts; I mean the whole shebang.

[Funguy33]

To paraphrase an ancient, Middle-Eastern rabbi: "Crap happens."


That's why bad things happen to good people.

Nothing in life is luck of the draw or coincidence... Read Deuteronomy 28 or Leviticus 26

Lamintations 3:32-33 says all evil comes only from God as a punishment for sin.

Yeah well, I got my information from the guy that inspired those passages. You'd think he'd know better, huh?

So, you are saying, you don't need to read the Bible because Jesus tells you everything you need to know?

How does Jesus interpret Exodus 34:7 or does He tell you to use white-out?

God thought this message was so important, He repeated it 5 times.

have you read the NT? I don't mean your favorite proof texts; I mean the whole shebang.

I have and they both tell about the consequences of sin...



In the Bible disability is viewed as a disease (The Interpreters Dictionary of the Bible: 1962; Encyclopaedia Judaica: 1972). The most common diseases mentioned in the Bible are blindness, deafness, dumbness, leprosy, and paralysis. Visual impairment is the most common form of physical disability in antiquity. Aside from people like Isaac (Gen. 27:1), Jacob (Gen. 48:10), Eli (1 Sam 3:2 and 4:15), and Ahijah the Shilomite (1Kings 14:4), whose eyesight failed in old age, natural causes of disability are not mentioned in the Bible. Disability is attributed to God. The general view of the Old Testament writers is that God brings disability as punishment for transgressions for sin or as an expression of God's wrath for people's disobedience. It is seen as a curse and as a result of unbelief and ignorance (Jewish Encyclopaedia, 1920; The Talmud of Jerusalem, 1956; and Encyclopaedia Judaica, 1972).

The Bible portrays disability as a curse and as a result of disobedience, unbelief, and ignorance. In Leviticus 26:14-16, as one of the punishments for Israel's disobedience is expressed in the following way: "I will bring upon you sudden terror, wasting diseases and fever that will destroy your sight and drain away your life." Samson also sinned against the Lord through his eyes; as it is written: "I have seen a Philistine woman in Timnah; now get her for me as my wife" (Judges 14:2). He was therefore punished through his eyes: "Then the Philistines seized him, gorged out his eyes" (Judges 16:21). Prov. 30:17 warns that the eyes, which are disrespectful to parents, will be plucked out by birds of prey.

The blindness of the wicked men of Sodom (Wisdom 2:21) and of Elymas, the magician who obstructed the work of Paul in Cyprus (Acts 13:4-12), are specifically attributed to divine punishment. The ancient nations regarded visual impairment as the lowest degradation that could be inflicted upon humans and, by extension, to a nation. The Deuteronomist suggests that visual impairment is a curse for disobeying the commandment of God. Israel was threatened for breaking the covenant.

The Lord will inflict you with madness, blindness and confusion of the mind. At midday, you will grope about like a blind man in the dark. You will be unsuccessful in everything that you do, day after day you will be oppressed and robbed, with no one to rescue you (Deut. 28:28-29).

Two cases of paralysis further confirm that God is the cause of disability. The sudden paralysis that afflicted King Jeroboam (1 Kings 13:4) attests to this. In Zechariah 11:17, a curse is invoked upon the "negligent shepherd." God's judgment is severe; Jeroboam's arm shrivels up completely. Zechariah says: "Woe to the worthless shepherd, who deserts the flock! May the sword strike his arm and his right eye! May his arm be completely withered, his right eye totally blinded."

Similarly, in 2 Chron. 26:16-23, we read the story of King Uzziah who, because of his unfaithfulness to God, was struck by leprosy "because the Lord had afflicted him" (Vs 20). Uzziah lived in a separate house and was excluded from the temple of the Lord because PWD were not allowed into the temple. They were considered unclean. Further examples that portray disability as a curse can be found in Zephaniah 1:17 and Zechariah 11:17. In Zephaniah, God promises to bring distress on the people because they have sinned against Him: "They will walk like blind men." God strikes his servant's assailants with blinding flashes (Gen. 19:11; 2 Kings 6:18-20 Acts 13:10-12) or with permanent blindness (Zech. 12:4; Ps 69:23) in order to protect his servants (see also Psalms 6:7 and 69:3).

The New Testament also supports the link between sin and disability. This link is well illustrated in John 9:1-3. The disciples anticipated a connection between disability and sin with the question: "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?" This question implies that disability was the punishment meant for some unspecified sin. When Jesus healed the physically impaired man who lay by the pool of Bethesda, He said to him: "See, you are well again. Stop sinning or something worse will happen to you" (Jn. 5:14). This clearly indicates that Jesus thought there was a connection between the man's disability and some sin. In the portico lay a multitude of PWD and this comment applied to them as well (Jn. 5:3).

Similarly, when Jesus healed the paralytic man lowered through the roof (Mk. 2:1-12), Jesus said to him: "Son, your sins are forgiven" (Vs 5), and then continued with the physical healing of the man. The implication of this comment is that it was necessary first to get the sin out of the way before the disability could be healed. According to Grant (1997:77), the healing stories of Jesus "have also served as proof of the moral imperfection of people with disabilities."

The conflation between sin and disability confirms the religious model of disability, which views disability as a punishment inflicted upon an individual or family by God as a result of sin. Consequently, disability stigmatizes not only the individual but the whole family. The implication is the exclusion of PWD from the social, economic, political, and spiritual spheres of society.

The metaphoric use of disability in the Bible further reinforces the view linking disability with disobedience to God. Israel's disobedience is compared with disability. In Isaiah 43:8 the children of Israel are asked to lead out those who have eyes but are blind, who have ears but are deaf. In Isaiah 42:18-20, Israel is compared to the blind and the deaf:

Hear, you deaf; look you blind, and see! Who is blind but my servant, and deaf like the messenger I send? Who is blind like the one committed to me, blind like the servant of the Lord? You have seen many things, but have paid no attention: your ears are open, but you hear nothing.

Hearing impairment symbolizes spiritual stubbornness or wilful refusal to hear and obey the word of God (Jer. 5:21; Ez. 12:2). Israel is portrayed as a servant with ears, but not hearing and obeying her Lord (Is 42:18-20). The prophet is pictured as calling the Israelites to hear the word of God because their sins had deafened their ears (Is 43:8). The Israelites in turn are pictured standing with their hands over their ears, refusing to hear the prophets even while judgment falls on them (Zech. 7:11-14). They are deaf like the idols they serve (Deut. 4:28; Ps 115:4-8; Rev. 9:20; The Dictionary of Biblical Imagery, 1998).

Throughout the Old Testament, visual impairment is viewed as a symbol of ignorance, sin, and unbelief. It refers to the lack of intellectual or moral understanding (Is 29:9-10, 18). Judges are warned that bribes or gifts blind the eyes of the discerning (Exodus 23:8). Blindness is used to describe those who dwell in the darkness of prison or captivity (Is. 42:7, 16-19; 43:8; 49:9; Ps 146:7-8). The Psalmist complains that since God has punished him, the light of his eyes has gone from him (Ps.38: 10) and he hopes that his enemies will be cursed with blindness (Ps. 69:23).

Those who have been forsaken by God complain that they grope "like those who have no eyes" (Is. 59:10), and when the day of the Lord comes, God will bring blindness upon people, "that they shall walk like the blind" (Zeph. 1:17). The most significant passage showing the metaphorical use of disability is the story of the vision of Isaiah in the temple:

Go and say to these people: "keep listening but do not comprehend. Keep looking, but do not understand. Make the mind of this people dull, and stop their ears, and shut their eyes, so that they may not look with their eyes, and listen with their ears, and comprehend with their minds, and turn and be healed."(Is. 6:9-10)

Isaiah 44:8-10 sounds a warning to all who speak up for those who make idols that they are blind and ignorant. In Isaiah 56:10, blindness refers to negligence: "Israel's watchmen are blind, they all lack knowledge; they are all mute dogs; they cannot bark, they lie around and dream, they love to sleep." Isaiah is told that his mission is to besmear the eyes of Israel so that it will not "see" and repent and be healed (6:10).

The legacy of blindness as a punishment from God or a metaphor for sin and disbelief continues in the New Testament. In general, the gospels show Jesus as sensitive and caring to PWD. They are the main focus of the healing ministry of Jesus (Mk 8:22-26; 10:46-52). At the same time, however, the negative images of disability in the Gospels are also significant. In the Gospel of John, sight and light are the symbols of truth while darkness and blindness are symbols of sin and unbelief. In John 9:41, Jesus responds to the continued questioning of the Pharisees with regard to the healing of a visually impaired person as follows: "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin."

According to Hull (2000), Jesus uses the expression "blind" as a term of abuse in the Gospel of Matthew. When Jesus attacks certain groups of people, he describes them as "blind guides" (Matt.23: 16, 24), "blind fools" (v.17), and "you blind Pharisees" (Vs.26). These verses give a disparaging image of blindness. Jesus called sighted people blind fools and teaches that the blind cannot lead the blind because they will both fall into a ditch. The metaphoric use of disability as a symbol of sin, unbelief, and ignorance further highlights the concept of disability as one that is viewed from a moral perspective.

Physical disability and the perfection of the body is another theme found in the Bible. In the very centre of this theology is the teaching found in the book of Leviticus, which sets forth the requirements for ministry. Physical imperfection is seen as an impediment to the exercise of the priestly office for the descendant of Aaron. In addition, the Lord spoke to Moses, saying:

Speak to Aaron, saying, none of your offspring throughout their generation who has a blemish may approach to offer the bread of his God. For no one who has a blemish shall draw near, a man blind or lame, or one who has a mutilated face or a limb too long, or a man who has an injured foot or an injured hand, or a hunchback or a dwarf or a man with a defect in his sight, or an itching disease or scabs or crushed testicles. No man of the offspring of Aaron the priest who has a blemish shall come near to offer the Lord's food offering; since he has a blemish, he shall not come near to offer the bread of his God. He may eat the bread of his God, both of the most holy and of the holy things, but he shall not go through the veil or approach the altar, because he has a blemish, that he may not profane my sanctuaries, for I am the Lord who sanctifies them (Leviticus 21:16-23).

The word "blemish" originally meant a "black spot." It later came to denote anything abnormal or deviating from a given standard, whether physical, moral, or ritualistic. The word "blemish" came to be used to describe the various abnormalities that disqualify one from priesthood (The Jewish Encyclopaedia, 1920).

The interpretation of this Leviticus text can be traced to the conflation between physical disability, perfection of the body, and moral impurity (Encyclopaedia Judaica: 1972). According to Eiesland (1994), the theological meaning of perfection has historically included physical flawlessness, and many religious orientations make a direct connection between physical perfection and spiritual beauty. Accordingly, PWD lack perfection and embody "un-wholeness." Wenham (1981:292 reference missing in Works Cited) also notes: "The idea emerges clearly that holiness finds physical expression in wholeness and normality." Physical disability is an obvious evidence of a person's sin and a sign of punishment from God. In other words, the perfection of the body is a symbol of the perfection of the soul (Melcher, 1998).

PWD are also viewed as unworthy in society. In 2 Sam 19:24-28, King David's servant, Ziba, bars Mephibosheth, who was physically impaired, from accompanying David on a trip. He was not worthy to be with the King because of his disability. Mephibosheth himself feels unworthy. In vs. 26, Mephibosheth says: "My Lord the King, since I your servant am lame." In addition, in Daniel 1:3-4, PWD are regarded as worthless. The king ordered Aphpenazi, chief of his court officials, to bring in some of the Israelites from the royal family and the nobility to be trained in the king's service. Vs 4 particularly emphasizes that the men should be handsome and without any physical defect. This view further reinforces the earlier prejudice, in which physical imperfection is seen as an impediment to the exercise of the priestly office for the descendant of Aaron.



[Edited to fix coding]

[HRoberson]

You might want to do a search for a "tower" story.


That rabbi is pretty clear - crap happens to everybody.

[Funguy33]

You might want to do a search for a "tower" story.


That rabbi is pretty clear - crap happens to everybody.

It only happens for what we deserve.

Some are born without arms and legs and others have beautiful lives, that is not a coincidence.

2 CORINTHIANS 5:10
"For we must all appear before the judgment seat
of Christ, that each one may receive what is
due him for the things done while in the body,
whether good or bad."

[Willie T]

In my twenties, I worked for several years at our State's main psychiatric hospital.  I've actually heard stranger beleifs here than I ever did there.

[Funguy33]

In my twenties, I worked for several years at our State's main psychiatric hospital.  I've actually heard stranger beleifs here than I ever did there.

It is easier to criticize than to give scripture to prove me wrong?

[HRoberson]

In my twenties, I worked for several years at our State's main psychiatric hospital.  I've actually heard stranger beleifs here than I ever did there.

It is easier to criticize than to give scripture to prove me wrong?

Have you read the tower story?


Have you read, "it rains on the just and the unjust?"


I'm not even sure what you're getting at with the different kinds of births; I don't know that "coincidence" is even applicable to the discussion.


Some people are born with blue eyes and some with green eyes. Is that a coincidence?

[Funguy33]

In my twenties, I worked for several years at our State's main psychiatric hospital.  I've actually heard stranger beleifs here than I ever did there.

It is easier to criticize than to give scripture to prove me wrong?

Have you read the tower story?


Have you read, "it rains on the just and the unjust?"


I'm not even sure what you're getting at with the different kinds of births; I don't know that "coincidence" is even applicable to the discussion.


Some people are born with blue eyes and some with green eyes. Is that a coincidence?

I haven't heard of either book, are they Christian authors?

Aren't rabbis considered the anti-Christ?

Jesus said not one sparrow can fall to the ground without God knowing...Matt 10:29

God told Jeremiah, He knew him in his mother's womb.

Those born with handicaps are being punished...Leviticus 21:16-23

[Lively Stone]

Those born with handicaps are being punished...Leviticus 21:16-23

Truly, you must refrain from posting such incendiary ideas.

Have you ever heard of Mephibosheth? Read  2 Samuel 9. Then tell us how God feels about the handicapped---and that isn't even the New Testament, which relates even more how WE ARE ALL HANDICAPPED by birth and destined for hellfire, EXCEPT FOR those who put their faith and trust in Jesus Christ.

[HRoberson]

In my twenties, I worked for several years at our State's main psychiatric hospital.  I've actually heard stranger beleifs here than I ever did there.

It is easier to criticize than to give scripture to prove me wrong?

Have you read the tower story?


Have you read, "it rains on the just and the unjust?"


I'm not even sure what you're getting at with the different kinds of births; I don't know that "coincidence" is even applicable to the discussion.


Some people are born with blue eyes and some with green eyes. Is that a coincidence?

I haven't heard of either book, are they Christian authors?

Aren't rabbis considered the anti-Christ?

Jesus said not one sparrow can fall to the ground without God knowing...Matt 10:29

God told Jeremiah, He knew him in his mother's womb.

Those born with handicaps are being punished...Leviticus 21:16-23

Yes, the authors are Christian. You might want to Google them.

[Nevertheless]

Yes, the authors are Christian. You might want to Google them.

HR, I was sorely tempted to take pity on him, but then I read comments like this

Those born with handicaps are being punished...Leviticus 21:16-23

and I just say, nah.....

[Funguy33]

Those born with handicaps are being punished...Leviticus 21:16-23

Truly, you must refrain from posting such incendiary ideas.

Have you ever heard of Mephibosheth? Read  2 Samuel 9. Then tell us how God feels about the handicapped---and that isn't even the New Testament, which relates even more how WE ARE ALL HANDICAPPED by birth and destined for hellfire, EXCEPT FOR those who put their faith and trust in Jesus Christ.

Because God never approved of Israel having a King, I don't think God favored  Mephibosheth. I think even David had second thoughts when he found out Mephibosheth wanted to take back the kingdom,..2 Samuel 16:3

[HRoberson]

Yes, the authors are Christian. You might want to Google them.

HR, I was sorely tempted to take pity on him, but then I read comments like this

Those born with handicaps are being punished...Leviticus 21:16-23

and I just say, nah.....

I'm thinking he's just playing with us; which is fine by me.

[Lively Stone]

Those born with handicaps are being punished...Leviticus 21:16-23

Truly, you must refrain from posting such incendiary ideas.

Have you ever heard of Mephibosheth? Read  2 Samuel 9. Then tell us how God feels about the handicapped---and that isn't even the New Testament, which relates even more how WE ARE ALL HANDICAPPED by birth and destined for hellfire, EXCEPT FOR those who put their faith and trust in Jesus Christ.

Because God never approved of Israel having a King, I don't think God favored  Mephibosheth. I think even David had second thoughts when he found out Mephibosheth wanted to take back the kingdom,..2 Samuel 16:3

Do you not perceive the message of Mephibosheth? God favours US! We are ALL handicapped, yet He seeks us out, brings us home, and because of our being in His family, we are welcomed to partake at His King's table---forever!

[howard]

Bad things happen because God is punishing for their sins of their past lives... Exodus 34:7

Jesus said to those He healed that if they sinned again it would be worse for them the next time... John 5:14

Revelation 12

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.


Romans 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:


WOE unto the inhabiters of the earth!!!

[Funguy33]

In Daniel 1:3-4, people with disabilities are regarded as worthless. The king ordered Aphpenazi, chief of his court officials, to bring in some of the Israelites from the royal family and the nobility to be trained in the king's service. Vs 4 particularly emphasizes that the men should be handsome and without any physical defect. This view further reinforces the earlier prejudice, in which physical imperfection is seen as an impediment to the exercise of the priestly office for the descendant of Aaron.

[Funguy33]

The Bible teaches that God is not only sovereign in controlling all things at all times, but is actually programming and guiding events in accordance with His eternal purposes. Ephesians 1:11 says that "He works all things after the counsel of His will." (See also Psalm 33:11 and Isaiah 43:13.)

[Wycliffes_Shillelagh]

I've answered the question in the OP at length in another thread just a couple days ago. 

Shameless plug to that thread:

http://www.gracecentered.com/christian_forums/theology/a-theology-of-the-obvious/

Jarrod

[MeMyself]

In Daniel 1:3-4, people with disabilities are regarded as worthless. The king ordered Aphpenazi, chief of his court officials, to bring in some of the Israelites from the royal family and the nobility to be trained in the king's service. Vs 4 particularly emphasizes that the men should be handsome and without any physical defect. This view further reinforces the earlier prejudice, in which physical imperfection is seen as an impediment to the exercise of the priestly office for the descendant of Aaron.

It does not call them worthless.  What a way to read the word and hateful way to look at those who are less fortunate than you who has apparently perfect health.    It just says what the specifications were for the job of being qualified to serve in the king's palace.  And, it wasn't God making the qualifications, it was the king