How Can A Person Reject Infallible Dogma/Theology and Claim to Believe in Jesus?

[Logical Conclusions]

I believe many people reject Infallible Dogma/Theology because they are Spiritually Lazy. They want Jesus to save them in Spiritual Laziness. 

[chosenone]

By infallible dogma, do you mean what The Bible says(infallible) or what man has said(fallible)?

[LightHammer]

I think people reject infallibility because they do not understand what it entails.

1. People tend to equate infallibility to impeccability. To be infallible is the ability to make an inerrant statement with regard to a specific topic within a specific context. To be impeccable is the ability to not commit any sins.

Because dictionaries are somehow a rarity these days people hear infallibility and think impeccability which usually leads to claims of idolatry because they see these as traits of divinity.

2. People also seem tone unable to understand the limits of infallibility. When we say the Church exercises infallibility that means ONLY we defining faith and morals. Apart from that the principle does not apply. However desperate opposers seeking to discredit the practice will often try to ciliate instances where the Church has errors as proof against infallibility in matters that are not related to faith and morals i.e. Galileo. 


Ignorance and misunderstanding sane ol same old.

[Lively Stone]

I believe many people reject Infallible Dogma/Theology because they are Spiritually Lazy. They want Jesus to save them in Spiritual Laziness. 

Spiritually lazy people tend to reject the infallible word of God and swallow hook, line and sinker the fallible theological reasonings of men.

[Logical Conclusions]

I believe many people reject Infallible Dogma/Theology because they are Spiritually Lazy. They want Jesus to save them in Spiritual Laziness. 

Spiritually lazy people tend to reject the infallible word of God and swallow hook, line and sinker the fallible theological reasonings of men.

I agree. That is why they are called Protestants.  They reject the reject the Catholic infallible word of God for there man-made inventions and wicked decices.

[DaveW]

That is why they are called Protestants.  They reject the reject the Catholic infallible word of God for there man-made inventions and wicked devices.

Everyone has their man-made traditions.

At least the ones in Judaism and Messianic Judaism were around when Our Lord was here and could comment on them.  Those HE did not specifically decry we kept.

The orthodox, rcc and protestant faith streams came about AFTER THE FACT so there is no biblical record of Our Lord commenting on them.

[MeMyself]

I believe many people reject Infallible Dogma/Theology because they are Spiritually Lazy. They want Jesus to save them in Spiritual Laziness. 

Spiritually lazy people tend to reject the infallible word of God and swallow hook, line and sinker the fallible theological reasonings of men.

I agree. That is why they are called Protestants.  They reject the reject the Catholic infallible word of God for there man-made inventions and wicked decices.

oh.brother!

[LightHammer]

That is why they are called Protestants.  They reject the reject the Catholic infallible word of God for there man-made inventions and wicked devices.

Everyone has their man-made traditions.

At least the ones in Judaism and Messianic Judaism were around when Our Lord was here and could comment on them.  Those HE did not specifically decry we kept.

The orthodox, rcc and protestant faith streams came about AFTER THE FACT so there is no biblical record of Our Lord commenting on them.

Messianic Judaism was not formed until the 19th century.

[Lively Stone]

I believe many people reject Infallible Dogma/Theology because they are Spiritually Lazy. They want Jesus to save them in Spiritual Laziness. 

Spiritually lazy people tend to reject the infallible word of God and swallow hook, line and sinker the fallible theological reasonings of men.

I agree. That is why they are called Protestants.  They reject the reject the Catholic infallible word of God for there man-made inventions and wicked decices.

Last time I looked, the word of God is simply the word of God...no modifiers.

[FireSword]

That is why they are called Protestants.  They reject the reject the Catholic infallible word of God for there man-made inventions and wicked devices.

Everyone has their man-made traditions.

At least the ones in Judaism and Messianic Judaism were around when Our Lord was here and could comment on them.  Those HE did not specifically decry we kept.

The orthodox, rcc and protestant faith streams came about AFTER THE FACT so there is no biblical record of Our Lord commenting on them.

Messianic Judaism was not formed until the 19th century.

Thats because of persecution scattering them across the world. Messianic Jews were preaching Jesus while Catholics were not even birthed yet.

I think the Nazarenes were the sect that cleansed virgin Mary as a kid.


After Jesus ascended to heaven, many of his followers stayed in Jerusalem and gathered into a closely-knit group that became known as the Nazarenes. According to Acts 1:13-16, the group initially had about 120 members, including Jesus' mother Mary and all of his brothers. The two main leaders were Simon Peter and the oldest brother of Jesus, who was called James the Just. During an early meeting a man named Matthias was chosen to replace the traitor Judas Iscariot in the inner circle of the twelve primary disciples.
The Nazarenes were the original core group from which Christianity grew and spread. But initially they still considered themselves to be Jews. They prayed in the temple at Jerusalem, and they followed most of the traditional Jewish religious practices. Other people in the city regarded them as a new Jewish sect.
But the Nazarenes differed from other Jewish sects in a fundamental way, for they believed that Jesus was the Messiah. They boldly took this message into the streets of Jerusalem and soon began to attract many new converts. They also spread the message to friends and relatives who lived in other places, and within a few years small groups of believers were established in several other cities.
At first most of the new converts were other Jews, many of whom were already interested in the prophesies about the Messiah. But then the apostle Paul began to convert many non-Jews (Gentiles). This led to a controversy when some Nazarenes from Jerusalem visited a community of new believers in Antioch and told some Gentile converts there that they would have to be circumcised in order to be saved. Paul strongly disagreed with this, and he made a special trip to Jerusalem to try to resolve the issue.
When he reached Jerusalem, a meeting was held to discuss the matter. Although some of the Nazarenes argued against Paul, Peter apparently took his side. After a lengthy debate, the final decision was that Gentile converts didn't have to be circumcised, but would still have to obey the Jewish laws relating to idolatry, sexual morality, and diet. This important meeting, sometimes called the Council of Jerusalem, is described in Acts 15:1-29.
During these early years the converts in other cities regarded the Nazarenes in Jerusalem as the final authority for deciding important issues. This was mainly due to the presence of Peter, James the Just, and other original believers. They were granted a special status because they had known Jesus personally.
But Peter eventually left Jerusalem. And mostly because of Paul's activities, the number of converts in other cities grew rapidly. For these reasons, the Nazarenes began to lose their influence. As the years passed, their continued adherence to the old Jewish religious practices left them increasingly out of touch with newer believers, many of whom came from outside Judaism.
In 66 AD a fierce war broke out in Palestine between the Roman army and a group of Jewish rebels. The casualties were enormous, especially among civilians, but most of the Nazarenes were able to save themselves by abandoning their homes and fleeing from Jerusalem. According to the church historian Eusebius, many of them fled to a place called Pella east of the Jordan River. But although most of them escaped, they had suffered a terrible blow.
By then Christianity had begun to separate from Judaism, and the Nazarenes quickly lost any remaining influence they might have had. There is evidence that many of them never accepted Paul as a true apostle and didn't approve of some of the practices in the churches he established. Perhaps partly for this reason, they gradually became isolated from the main Christian movement, and had little effect on the subsequent history of the church.

[FireSword]

I think people reject infallibility because they do not understand what it entails.

1. People tend to equate infallibility to impeccability. To be infallible is the ability to make an inerrant statement with regard to a specific topic within a specific context. To be impeccable is the ability to not commit any sins.

Because dictionaries are somehow a rarity these days people hear infallibility and think impeccability which usually leads to claims of idolatry because they see these as traits of divinity.

2. People also seem tone unable to understand the limits of infallibility. When we say the Church exercises infallibility that means ONLY we defining faith and morals. Apart from that the principle does not apply. However desperate opposers seeking to discredit the practice will often try to ciliate instances where the Church has errors as proof against infallibility in matters that are not related to faith and morals i.e. Galileo. 


Ignorance and misunderstanding sane ol same old.

Ignorance on part of the Catholic church, who do not regard the masses, but rather coin usage of words that deliberately keep the truth from the masses. A sin of pride. Same old same old.

[Ladonia]

That is why they are called Protestants.  They reject the reject the Catholic infallible word of God for there man-made inventions and wicked devices.

Everyone has their man-made traditions.

At least the ones in Judaism and Messianic Judaism were around when Our Lord was here and could comment on them.  Those HE did not specifically decry we kept.

The orthodox, rcc and protestant faith streams came about AFTER THE FACT so there is no biblical record of Our Lord commenting on them.

Messianic Judaism was not formed until the 19th century.

Thats because of persecution scattering them across the world. Messianic Jews were preaching Jesus while Catholics were not even birthed yet.

I think the Nazarenes were the sect that cleansed virgin Mary as a kid.


After Jesus ascended to heaven, many of his followers stayed in Jerusalem and gathered into a closely-knit group that became known as the Nazarenes. According to Acts 1:13-16, the group initially had about 120 members, including Jesus' mother Mary and all of his brothers. The two main leaders were Simon Peter and the oldest brother of Jesus, who was called James the Just. During an early meeting a man named Matthias was chosen to replace the traitor Judas Iscariot in the inner circle of the twelve primary disciples.
The Nazarenes were the original core group from which Christianity grew and spread. But initially they still considered themselves to be Jews. They prayed in the temple at Jerusalem, and they followed most of the traditional Jewish religious practices. Other people in the city regarded them as a new Jewish sect.
But the Nazarenes differed from other Jewish sects in a fundamental way, for they believed that Jesus was the Messiah. They boldly took this message into the streets of Jerusalem and soon began to attract many new converts. They also spread the message to friends and relatives who lived in other places, and within a few years small groups of believers were established in several other cities.
At first most of the new converts were other Jews, many of whom were already interested in the prophesies about the Messiah. But then the apostle Paul began to convert many non-Jews (Gentiles). This led to a controversy when some Nazarenes from Jerusalem visited a community of new believers in Antioch and told some Gentile converts there that they would have to be circumcised in order to be saved. Paul strongly disagreed with this, and he made a special trip to Jerusalem to try to resolve the issue.
When he reached Jerusalem, a meeting was held to discuss the matter. Although some of the Nazarenes argued against Paul, Peter apparently took his side. After a lengthy debate, the final decision was that Gentile converts didn't have to be circumcised, but would still have to obey the Jewish laws relating to idolatry, sexual morality, and diet. This important meeting, sometimes called the Council of Jerusalem, is described in Acts 15:1-29.
During these early years the converts in other cities regarded the Nazarenes in Jerusalem as the final authority for deciding important issues. This was mainly due to the presence of Peter, James the Just, and other original believers. They were granted a special status because they had known Jesus personally.
But Peter eventually left Jerusalem. And mostly because of Paul's activities, the number of converts in other cities grew rapidly. For these reasons, the Nazarenes began to lose their influence. As the years passed, their continued adherence to the old Jewish religious practices left them increasingly out of touch with newer believers, many of whom came from outside Judaism.
In 66 AD a fierce war broke out in Palestine between the Roman army and a group of Jewish rebels. The casualties were enormous, especially among civilians, but most of the Nazarenes were able to save themselves by abandoning their homes and fleeing from Jerusalem. According to the church historian Eusebius, many of them fled to a place called Pella east of the Jordan River. But although most of them escaped, they had suffered a terrible blow.
By then Christianity had begun to separate from Judaism, and the Nazarenes quickly lost any remaining influence they might have had. There is evidence that many of them never accepted Paul as a true apostle and didn't approve of some of the practices in the churches he established. Perhaps partly for this reason, they gradually became isolated from the main Christian movement, and had little effect on the subsequent history of the church.

Please tell us  from where you cut and pasted the majority of your response.

[Paulus]

The originator of this thread gave it the title " How Can A Person Reject Infallible Dogma/Theology and Claim to Believe in Jesus ? "

Reply#4 indicates that it is Roman Catholic dogma that is being referred to in this thread .

As a Roman Catholic I find such a question offensive . It is based on divisive , uneducated and unCatholic twaddle .

I am surrounded by many Christians , some of them friends and family members , who do not adhere to RC dogmas but who have a deep belief in Jesus and are devoted to him in their daily living .

Some people who visit this Forum need to get a life . 

[FireSword]

Please tell us  from where you cut and pasted the majority of your response.

From gospel-mysteries.net

Some interesting stuff, you might like it.

[LightHammer]

That is why they are called Protestants.  They reject the reject the Catholic infallible word of God for there man-made inventions and wicked devices.

Everyone has their man-made traditions.

At least the ones in Judaism and Messianic Judaism were around when Our Lord was here and could comment on them.  Those HE did not specifically decry we kept.

The orthodox, rcc and protestant faith streams came about AFTER THE FACT so there is no biblical record of Our Lord commenting on them.

Messianic Judaism was not formed until the 19th century.

Thats because of persecution scattering them across the world. Messianic Jews were preaching Jesus while Catholics were not even birthed yet.

I think the Nazarenes were the sect that cleansed virgin Mary as a kid.


After Jesus ascended to heaven, many of his followers stayed in Jerusalem and gathered into a closely-knit group that became known as the Nazarenes. According to Acts 1:13-16, the group initially had about 120 members, including Jesus' mother Mary and all of his brothers. The two main leaders were Simon Peter and the oldest brother of Jesus, who was called James the Just. During an early meeting a man named Matthias was chosen to replace the traitor Judas Iscariot in the inner circle of the twelve primary disciples.
The Nazarenes were the original core group from which Christianity grew and spread. But initially they still considered themselves to be Jews. They prayed in the temple at Jerusalem, and they followed most of the traditional Jewish religious practices. Other people in the city regarded them as a new Jewish sect.
But the Nazarenes differed from other Jewish sects in a fundamental way, for they believed that Jesus was the Messiah. They boldly took this message into the streets of Jerusalem and soon began to attract many new converts. They also spread the message to friends and relatives who lived in other places, and within a few years small groups of believers were established in several other cities.
At first most of the new converts were other Jews, many of whom were already interested in the prophesies about the Messiah. But then the apostle Paul began to convert many non-Jews (Gentiles). This led to a controversy when some Nazarenes from Jerusalem visited a community of new believers in Antioch and told some Gentile converts there that they would have to be circumcised in order to be saved. Paul strongly disagreed with this, and he made a special trip to Jerusalem to try to resolve the issue.
When he reached Jerusalem, a meeting was held to discuss the matter. Although some of the Nazarenes argued against Paul, Peter apparently took his side. After a lengthy debate, the final decision was that Gentile converts didn't have to be circumcised, but would still have to obey the Jewish laws relating to idolatry, sexual morality, and diet. This important meeting, sometimes called the Council of Jerusalem, is described in Acts 15:1-29.
During these early years the converts in other cities regarded the Nazarenes in Jerusalem as the final authority for deciding important issues. This was mainly due to the presence of Peter, James the Just, and other original believers. They were granted a special status because they had known Jesus personally.
But Peter eventually left Jerusalem. And mostly because of Paul's activities, the number of converts in other cities grew rapidly. For these reasons, the Nazarenes began to lose their influence. As the years passed, their continued adherence to the old Jewish religious practices left them increasingly out of touch with newer believers, many of whom came from outside Judaism.
In 66 AD a fierce war broke out in Palestine between the Roman army and a group of Jewish rebels. The casualties were enormous, especially among civilians, but most of the Nazarenes were able to save themselves by abandoning their homes and fleeing from Jerusalem. According to the church historian Eusebius, many of them fled to a place called Pella east of the Jordan River. But although most of them escaped, they had suffered a terrible blow.
By then Christianity had begun to separate from Judaism, and the Nazarenes quickly lost any remaining influence they might have had. There is evidence that many of them never accepted Paul as a true apostle and didn't approve of some of the practices in the churches he established. Perhaps partly for this reason, they gradually became isolated from the main Christian movement, and had little effect on the subsequent history of the church.

Stop copying and pasting junk from the internet. Messianic Judaism did not begin until the 19th century and it came from Judaism. If you follow the lineage back Judaism was in the first and second century killing Christians not spreading the Gospel.
Only someone of a sect that has no history would fall for such a unimpressive distortion.

[FireSword]

I would not call some of the first evangelists junk, especially as the True Mary of scripture is among them.

[HRoberson]

In re: OP,

Because they are two different things.

[n2thelight]

I believe many people reject Infallible Dogma/Theology because they are Spiritually Lazy. They want Jesus to save them in Spiritual Laziness. 

And you all pray to dead people,why???

[neophyte]

Those souls /saints in heaven are more alive than you or me.

[DaveW]

Those souls /saints in heaven are more alive than you or me.

There - yes.  Here - they are dead and it is a violation of Torah to communicate with them.

[neophyte]

DaveW- wrong,  nowhere does the Catholic Church teach that we must pray to dead people on earth. LOL

[chosenone]

DaveW- wrong,  nowhere does the Catholic Church teach that we must pray to dead people on earth. LOL

SO why do you do it then?

[Catholica]

DaveW- wrong,  nowhere does the Catholic Church teach that we must pray to dead people on earth. LOL

SO why do you do it then?

He doesn't, nor does any Catholic.

[Lively Stone]

Those souls /saints in heaven are more alive than you or me.

No, they are just as alive as you and me. They do not have powers to hear or answer people's prayers, just as you don't.

[Carey]

DaveW- wrong,  nowhere does the Catholic Church teach that we must pray to dead people on earth. LOL

SO why do you do it then?

He doesn't, nor does any Catholic.

Do you deny you pray to Mary, or rather she is not a "dead people on earth"?

The way I understand it, Mary is an advocate, and not prayed to, rather talked to? 

The Bible is clear as to not seeking mediums, or necromancers to communicate with the dead, but what of just saying a few words for example to my deceased mother;  telling her I miss her.

I have never gone so far as to ask her to advocate on my behalf, for I do not see that as her role, but that is not from an authoritive viewpoint rather my opinion.

But enough rambling and to the point, does Catholocism endorse praying to Mary?  Looking through these "prayers," labelled such as that is how they are portrayed on this site, what are they?

http://www.marypages.com/PrayerstoMary.htm

Further many of these prayers are done before a statue of the Virgin, leading to further implicationsn regarding idol worship.

I do not seek to condemn Catholocism rather understanding, as I do wonder how this is reconciled.  Unlike some protestents, I do consider my Catholic friends and family brothers and sisters, fellow believers, and Christians like myself, although perhaps misguided.  I will qualify that I myself may too be misguided, actually given the diversity in the Body, I am pretty certain that in some aspects that is a surety.

[chosenone]

So why do you say hail Marys, and otherwise communicate with Mary and other dead people?

[Catholica]

DaveW- wrong,  nowhere does the Catholic Church teach that we must pray to dead people on earth. LOL

SO why do you do it then?

He doesn't, nor does any Catholic.

Do you deny you pray to Mary, or rather she is not a "dead people on earth"?

Of course we pray to Mary, aka praying for Mary to intercede for us.  She is not on earth, nor is she dead.

The way I understand it, Mary is an advocate, and not prayed to, rather talked to?

One can pray in their head or out loud, it doesn't matter, God allows Mary to hear those requests for intercession.  We call the request for intercession from the saints "praying to" them; this is borrowed from the older English usage of the word "pray" which simply meant "to ask", in this case, to ask for intercession.

The Bible is clear as to not seeking mediums, or necromancers to communicate with the dead, but what of just saying a few words for example to my deceased mother;  telling her I miss her.

Good point!  This is different from mediums or necromancers or other communications because we are not requesting hidden information or to know the future.  There is no desire for an audible reply or what not.  These things (necromancy, mediums) are condemned by God because we are to trust God for the future and not try to grasp it ourselves.  They are a means of "controlling God" and in a way reflect the original sin.  Asking someone to pray for you is not a sin, and the implied (if not explicit) notion of praying to the saints is that they are asking God for whatever the prayer is asking, not granting it themselves.

I have never gone so far as to ask her to advocate on my behalf, for I do not see that as her role, but that is not from an authoritive viewpoint rather my opinion.

Understood.

But enough rambling and to the point, does Catholocism endorse praying to Mary?  Looking through these "prayers," labelled such as that is how they are portrayed on this site, what are they?

Yes Catholicism does acknowledge the intercessory ability of the saints in heaven, who are more, not less, alive than you or I.

Further many of these prayers are done before a statue of the Virgin, leading to further implicationsn regarding idol worship.

It's no more idol worship to talk to the saints before a status than it is for you to talk to your deceased mother's picture, may God rest her soul, is it?

Biblical idol worshipers believed not that the carved images were representations of their gods, but rather that the carved images *were* their gods.  Worshiping a created object as a god is condemned in the Bible.   That is where our modern confusion comes in play about this particular commandment.  Statues are like pictures, and we don't worship the statues themselves, nor do we worship the saints.

Iconoclasty was a heresy that said that images could not be used that popped up around the 8th century.  It was put to rest at the 7th Ecumenical council. 

God ordered graven cherubim to be placed on the ark of the covenant.  He also commanded a carved snake to be place on a staff.  Carving things in itself is therefore not a sin, else God commanded some to sin.  Worshiping a carved object as a God is a sin.  When Israel started worshiping the snake on the staff as a god, He then commanded it destroyed.

I do not seek to condemn Catholocism rather understanding, as I do wonder how this is reconciled.  Unlike some protestents, I do consider my Catholic friends and family brothers and sisters, fellow believers, and Christians like myself, although perhaps misguided.  I will qualify that I myself may too be misguided, actually given the diversity in the Body, I am pretty certain that in some aspects that is a surety.

You have a good heart.  We believe that when people die and go to heaven, that they are still alive and part of the one vine, the body of Christ.  Because of our New Covenant elevated role to take part in the divine life of Christ, even after death those who die in Christ's friendship are still alive and can still be channels of grace, especially through their prayers.  There is evidence of intercession of saints in heaven in Revelation (5:8 IIRC) and also of the angels in Revelation (8:3-5 IIRC).

Hope that helps!

[Catholica]

So why do you say hail Marys, and otherwise communicate with Mary

So that she might pray for us to God.  You know that.

and other dead people?

We don't communicate with dead people.

[FireSword]

One can pray in their head or out loud, it doesn't matter, God allows Mary to hear those requests for intercession.  We call the request for intercession from the saints "praying to" them; this is borrowed from the older English usage of the word "pray" which simply meant "to ask", in this case, to ask for intercession.

I tried this Mary thing, to see what happens. I had a negative experience 

[Catholica]

One can pray in their head or out loud, it doesn't matter, God allows Mary to hear those requests for intercession.  We call the request for intercession from the saints "praying to" them; this is borrowed from the older English usage of the word "pray" which simply meant "to ask", in this case, to ask for intercession.

I tried this Mary thing, to see what happens. I had a negative experience 

No doubt you did.  The last thing the devil wants is for you to ask Mary to pray for you.  I had negative experiences when I first prayed to Mary as well. 

[Carey]

Hope that helps!

It does, seem like reasonable answers to me.  So many think that we are so far apart;  Catholics and the many denominational and non-denominational, but that which unites us is our belief in our saviour.  I tend to believe the unity to which we are directed is not under the canopy of my "church", your church, or any other; there is but one Church to which we all belong.  It is a church of much diversity, but diversity is not a bad thing and can lead to successes where homogenity would fail.

Our church has such a wonderful fellowship with the Catholic church next door.  I wish all could embrace such a relationship.  We support them, they support us; we collaborate all in the service of the Lord.

[FireSword]

Hope that helps!

It does, seem like reasonable answers to me.  So many think that we are so far apart;  Catholics and the many denominational and non-denominational, but that which unites us is our belief in our saviour.  I tend to believe the unity to which we are directed is not under the canopy of my "church", your church, or any other; there is but one Church to which we all belong.  It is a church of much diversity, but diversity is not a bad thing and can lead to successes where homogenity would fail.

Our church has such a wonderful fellowship with the Catholic church next door.  I wish all could embrace such a relationship.  We support them, they support us; we collaborate all in the service of the Lord.

This is what I believe Jesus meant for us to be one. God is a big God and there is many variety of peoples, we can't all sing to the same tune and dance to the same dance.

[Lively Stone]

One can pray in their head or out loud, it doesn't matter, God allows Mary to hear those requests for intercession.  We call the request for intercession from the saints "praying to" them; this is borrowed from the older English usage of the word "pray" which simply meant "to ask", in this case, to ask for intercession.

I tried this Mary thing, to see what happens. I had a negative experience 

No doubt you did.  The last thing the devil wants is for you to ask Mary to pray for you.  I had negative experiences when I first prayed to Mary as well.

I can't count how many times a Catholic person has denied that Catholics pray to Mary. Finally, here's one who tells the truth.

More truth is this: the devil wants people to pray to Mary, because he hates it when they understand that we are to pray to Jesus.

[n2thelight]

Catholica

We don't communicate with dead people.

From that logic nobody is dead,as all return to heaven,so my question is who are the dead that we are not to communicate with?

[Carey]

Hope that helps!

It does, seem like reasonable answers to me.  So many think that we are so far apart;  Catholics and the many denominational and non-denominational, but that which unites us is our belief in our saviour.  I tend to believe the unity to which we are directed is not under the canopy of my "church", your church, or any other; there is but one Church to which we all belong.  It is a church of much diversity, but diversity is not a bad thing and can lead to successes where homogenity would fail.

Our church has such a wonderful fellowship with the Catholic church next door.  I wish all could embrace such a relationship.  We support them, they support us; we collaborate all in the service of the Lord.

This is what I believe Jesus meant for us to be one. God is a big God and there is many variety of peoples, we can't all sing to the same tune and dance to the same dance.

Or in my case sing any tune or dance any dance, well maybe a slow dance is not too much beyond my abilities and I can whistle pretty good.