young men...

[dotterofzion]

This increased campaign against priestly celibacy in my view is baseless. The church has rules which are binding until dissolved by the pope. No one is oblidged or forced to become a priest. Joining the priesthood remains voluntary (Matt. 19 vs.11).If a young man desires to marry then he shouldn't volunteer to become a priest. He can serve God as a laity in any godly way and still be effective in the church. Altimately our goal as catholics/christians is to live eternal life with Christ.

[FireSword]

Paul said it is better to marry than burn with lust.

[chosenone]

This increased campaign against priestly celibacy in my view is baseless. The church has rules which are binding until dissolved by the pope. No one is oblidged or forced to become a priest. Joining the priesthood remains voluntary (Matt. 19 vs.11).If a young man desires to marry then he shouldn't volunteer to become a priest. He can serve God as a laity in any godly way and still be effective in the church. Altimately our goal as catholics/christians is to live eternal life with Christ.

Man made rules and not Gods rules. In fact God says that leaders of the church should be the man of one wife. This idea that they should be celibate and not marry is totally against Gods teaching. Apart from that how can any of them have the first idea about marriage and children and real life when they have no experience of it?

Did you know that in the USA 1/3rd of RC priests are gay?

[chosenone]

This increased campaign against priestly celibacy in my view is baseless. The church has rules which are binding until dissolved by the pope. No one is oblidged or forced to become a priest. Joining the priesthood remains voluntary (Matt. 19 vs.11).If a young man desires to marry then he shouldn't volunteer to become a priest. He can serve God as a laity in any godly way and still be effective in the church. Altimately our goal as catholics/christians is to live eternal life with Christ.

  So if a man marries he cant have eternal life???

[DaveW]

Paul says congregational leaders are to be the "... husband of one wife."

To me, that means if a person has the charismatic gift of celibacy and serves God that way he CANNOT be in congregational leadership.

[Catholica]

Paul said it is better to marry than burn with lust.

Paul also said that he wishes that all could be as he was: celibate.

[Catholica]

In fact God says that leaders of the church should be the man of one wife.

And the correct interpretation of that is that they are not someone who has been divorced and remarried, e.g. no serial adulterers.  Jesus said that 'some have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom; who can accept it should accept this'.  Jesus is not endorsing bodily mutilation, he is referring to those who have chosen to remain celibate.

Apart from that how can any of them have the first idea about marriage and children and real life when they have no experience of it?

Our faith is applicable to all states in life, whether married, single, consecrated.  There is one gospel which we apply to everyone.  The Bible is equally applicable to those who are married and who are not.

Did you know that in the USA 1/3rd of RC priests are gay?

If that were true, (which it is not) what would that have to do with anything?

[Catholica]

Paul says congregational leaders are to be the "... husband of one wife."

To me, that means if a person has the charismatic gift of celibacy and serves God that way he CANNOT be in congregational leadership.

Husband of one wife, rather a than serial adulterer.

[Catholica]

This increased campaign against priestly celibacy in my view is baseless. The church has rules which are binding until dissolved by the pope. No one is oblidged or forced to become a priest. Joining the priesthood remains voluntary (Matt. 19 vs.11).If a young man desires to marry then he shouldn't volunteer to become a priest. He can serve God as a laity in any godly way and still be effective in the church. Altimately our goal as catholics/christians is to live eternal life with Christ.

So if a man marries he cant have eternal life???

Is that honestly what you think she is saying?

[chosenone]

In fact God says that leaders of the church should be the man of one wife.

And the correct interpretation of that is that they are not someone who has been divorced and remarried, e.g. no serial adulterers.  Jesus said that 'some have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom; who can accept it should accept this'.  Jesus is not endorsing bodily mutilation, he is referring to those who have chosen to remain celibate.

Apart from that how can any of them have the first idea about marriage and children and real life when they have no experience of it?

Our faith is applicable to all states in life, whether married, single, consecrated.  There is one gospel which we apply to everyone.  The Bible is equally applicable to those who are married and who are not.

Did you know that in the USA 1/3rd of RC priests are gay?

If that were true, (which it is not) what would that have to do with anything?

No the correct interpretation is that the man must be a 'one women man' ie he must not have more than one wife at a time. Some men at that time did have more than one wife.

A church leader not being allowed to marry is entirely against what God says.

[chosenone]

This increased campaign against priestly celibacy in my view is baseless. The church has rules which are binding until dissolved by the pope. No one is oblidged or forced to become a priest. Joining the priesthood remains voluntary (Matt. 19 vs.11).If a young man desires to marry then he shouldn't volunteer to become a priest. He can serve God as a laity in any godly way and still be effective in the church. Altimately our goal as catholics/christians is to live eternal life with Christ.

So if a man marries he cant have eternal life???

Is that honestly what you think she is saying?

Yes that's what he seems to be saying.

[chosenone]

In fact God says that leaders of the church should be the man of one wife.

And the correct interpretation of that is that they are not someone who has been divorced and remarried, e.g. no serial adulterers.  Jesus said that 'some have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom; who can accept it should accept this'.  Jesus is not endorsing bodily mutilation, he is referring to those who have chosen to remain celibate.

Apart from that how can any of them have the first idea about marriage and children and real life when they have no experience of it?

Our faith is applicable to all states in life, whether married, single, consecrated.  There is one gospel which we apply to everyone.  The Bible is equally applicable to those who are married and who are not.

Did you know that in the USA 1/3rd of RC priests are gay?

If that were true, (which it is not) what would that have to do with anything?

I saw in indepth study is RC priests in the USA and that's what they concluded.

[chosenone]

Paul said it is better to marry than burn with lust.

Paul also said that he wishes that all could be as he was: celibate.

Merely Pauls opinion. God says that it is not good for man to be alone.

[AnnaM]

This idea that they should be celibate and not marry is totally against Gods teaching.

Marriage is a good state when observed properly, but the celibate state is better.  In 1 Cor. 7, St. Paul clearly teaches the superiority of the celibate state to the married state, thus providing a powerful refutation of the Protestant denial of this truth.

1 Corinthians, Chap. 7- "Now concerning the thing whereof you wrote to me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.  But for fear of fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband... But I speak this by indulgence, not by commandment. For I would that all men were even as myself [unmarried]: but every one hath his proper gift from God; one after this manner, and another after that. But I say to the unmarried, and to the widows: It is good for them if they so continue, even as I...

But if any man think that he seemeth dishonoured, with regard to his virgin, for that she is above the age, and it must so be: let him do what he will; he sinneth not, if she marry.  For he that hath determined being steadfast in his heart, having no necessity, but having power of his own will; and hath judged this in his heart, to keep his virgin, doth well.  Therefore, both he that giveth his virgin in marriage, doth well; and he that giveth her not, doth better."

We see that St. Paul clearly identifies the state of virginity or celibacy as a state that is better than the state of marriage.  We also see this in the words of Jesus Himself:

Matthew 19: 11-12- "[Jesus] said to them: All men take not this word, but they to whom it is given.  For there are eunuchs, who were born so from their mother's womb: and there are eunuchs, who were made so by men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven. He that can take, let him take it."

Jesus is clearly speaking here of those who live singly and chastely for the sake of the kingdom of God.  As the Catholic commentary in the Douay Rheims Bible notes about this verse: "There are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs, for the kingdom of heaven... This text is not to be taken in the literal sense; but means, that there are such, who have taken a firm and commendable resolution of leading a single and chaste life, in order to serve God in a more perfect state than those who marry: as St. Paul clearly shows. 1 Cor. 7. 37, 38."

This biblical truth, which is rejected by the Protestants, was taught repeatedly by the fathers of the Church – that is, those prominent Christian writers of the earliest centuries who repeated the truths learned from the apostles.  Here are two of numerous examples that could be given.

St. John Chrysostom, A.D. 392: "That virginity is good I do agree.  But that it is even better than marriage, this I do confess. And if you wish, I will add that it is as much better than marriage as Heaven is better than Earth, as much better as angels are better than men." (The Faith of the Early Fathers, Vol. 2: 1116)

St. Cyril of Jerusalem, A.D. 350: "While you maintain perfect chastity, do not be puffed up in vain conceit against those who walk a humbler path in matrimony.... Because you have a possession of gold, do not on that account hold the silver in contempt." (The Faith of the Early Fathers, Vol. 1: 818c)

- Quoted from Bro. Peter Dimond, vaticancatholic.com

Did you know that in the USA 1/3rd of RC priests are gay?

No, those are not RC priests. They're the bad fruits of the Vatican II sect which is not at all connected to the RC Church.

[Catholica]

In fact God says that leaders of the church should be the man of one wife.

And the correct interpretation of that is that they are not someone who has been divorced and remarried, e.g. no serial adulterers.  Jesus said that 'some have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom; who can accept it should accept this'.  Jesus is not endorsing bodily mutilation, he is referring to those who have chosen to remain celibate.

Apart from that how can any of them have the first idea about marriage and children and real life when they have no experience of it?

Our faith is applicable to all states in life, whether married, single, consecrated.  There is one gospel which we apply to everyone.  The Bible is equally applicable to those who are married and who are not.

Did you know that in the USA 1/3rd of RC priests are gay?

If that were true, (which it is not) what would that have to do with anything?

No the correct interpretation is that the man must be a 'one women man' ie he must not have more than one wife at a time. Some men at that time did have more than one wife.

That either.  What God says is that once we get married, let no man separate.  Thus the husband of one wife is also not someone who has divorced a wife and married another.

This means that a celibate man is fine for ministry.

[Catholica]

This increased campaign against priestly celibacy in my view is baseless. The church has rules which are binding until dissolved by the pope. No one is oblidged or forced to become a priest. Joining the priesthood remains voluntary (Matt. 19 vs.11).If a young man desires to marry then he shouldn't volunteer to become a priest. He can serve God as a laity in any godly way and still be effective in the church. Altimately our goal as catholics/christians is to live eternal life with Christ.

So if a man marries he cant have eternal life???

Is that honestly what you think she is saying?

Yes that's what he seems to be saying.

No, that's not what (she) is saying.  Let me interpret from a Catholic understanding.  In eternal life, there are none married or given in marriage.  The priest (and consecrated religious) are an image of that eternal reality in the here and now.  That is what she means.

[Catholica]

Paul said it is better to marry than burn with lust.

Paul also said that he wishes that all could be as he was: celibate.

Merely Pauls opinion.

Jesus also had that opinion.  He who can accept it should accept it.

[Catholica]

Did you know that in the USA 1/3rd of RC priests are gay?

If that were true, (which it is not) what would that have to do with anything?

I saw in indepth study is RC priests in the USA and that's what they concluded.

You didn't answer my question.

[BlackSepulcher]

Priesthood or family- you can try to do both, but you're just going to disappoint both.

A priests life is extraordinarily busy, they do not clock in like pastors and protestant evangelists. Every day of their life is priesthood, and it's very honorable.

It should be something to herald, not criticize. In fact, the motives for worrying about it is worn pretty plainly on the sleeves of those who do so.

[chosenone]

Priesthood or family- you can try to do both, but you're just going to disappoint both.

A priests life is extraordinarily busy, they do not clock in like pastors and protestant evangelists. Every day of their life is priesthood, and it's very honorable.

It should be something to herald, not criticize. In fact, the motives for worrying about it is worn pretty plainly on the sleeves of those who do so.

All the married pastors and vicars I have known seem to do a very good job(and they don't clock in and out any more than yours do), and because they are married and have families they are far more in touch with their congregations. Their wives also do invaluable work in the church, as well as supporting their husbands. Church leaders are supposed to be married, that is what God says.

[Catholica]

Priesthood or family- you can try to do both, but you're just going to disappoint both.

A priests life is extraordinarily busy, they do not clock in like pastors and protestant evangelists. Every day of their life is priesthood, and it's very honorable.

It should be something to herald, not criticize. In fact, the motives for worrying about it is worn pretty plainly on the sleeves of those who do so.

All the married pastors and vicars I have known seem to do a very good job(and they don't clock in and out any more than yours do), and because they are married and have families they are far more in touch with their congregations. Their wives also do invaluable work in the church, as well as supporting their husbands.

I would posit that priests are far more in touch with God and the gospel by the fact that they ARE celibate.  For this I quote the scriptures: "An unmarried man is anxious about the things of the Lord, how he may please the Lord. But a married man is anxious about the things of the world, how he may please his wife, and he is divided. "  And being more in touch with God allows them to serve all, including those who are single (celibate) as well as those who are married. 

It is God who teaches us to live, not human experience.  Humans fail when they go by their own experience.  One person's experience in marriage is going to be different from others.  It is through the principles of the Gospel that we can know how to best help people in all situations.

And there are lots of people who do good work in the Church to help the priest, lots of good women to whom the priest doesn't have to be married.  The argument that the wife "does invaluable work" is moot.  Any woman could do that work, it doesn't have to be the pastor's wife.

[dotterofzion]

Catholica, I could have written your post, as usual perfect anwser.

[dotterofzion]

Catholica, I could have written your post, as usual perfect anwser.