no Holy Ghost needed - we have the scriptures

[wincam]

it has not been realised that the Holy Spirit was given to the Apostles and early Christians as they did not have the scriptures as we do to search to see if these things be so - see Jn.14:16,17and 26 and 15:26 and 16:7 and 13 - wincam

[Barley]

Joh 17:20  Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
Joh 17:21  That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:22  And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
Joh 17:23  I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
Joh 17:24  Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
Joh 17:25  O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:26  And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
Joh 16:12  I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
Joh 16:13  Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
Joh 16:14  He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
Joh 16:15  All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

"No Holy Ghost needed – we have the Scriptures"


Without ears to hear and eyes to see they study the Scripture in vain.
Never knowing the Father Son or Spirit, unable to understand Scripture.
Under a veil of darkness.
Lord have mercy.

[LexKnight]

Wincam, they had Genesis-Malachi. What do you think the Bereans studied to confirm their teaching?

[Rella]

it has not been realised that the Holy Spirit was given to the Apostles and early Christians as they did not have the scriptures as we do to search to see if these things be so - see Jn.14:16,17and 26 and 15:26 and 16:7 and 13 - wincam

What a frightening thought.

There are rarely 2 people who are members of Grace Centered what can read scriptures and come to the same conclusion about what they read.

If anything , we need the Holy Spirits divine guidance for understanding as we pray on what we read.

[doorknocker]

Joh 17:20  Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
Joh 17:21  That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:22  And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
Joh 17:23  I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
Joh 17:24  Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
Joh 17:25  O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:26  And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
Joh 16:12  I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
Joh 16:13  Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
Joh 16:14  He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
Joh 16:15  All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

"No Holy Ghost needed – we have the Scriptures"


Without ears to hear and eyes to see they study the Scripture in vain.
Never knowing the Father Son or Spirit, unable to understand Scripture.
Under a veil of darkness.
Lord have mercy.

I fully agree.

[mclees8]

It is the Holy sprit that brings us into all truth concerning the word of God  With out the anointing of the Holy Spirit the Bible is just another book that  says a lot of religious things, but it is only carnal knowledge. Only the Holy Spirit reveals Christ in the heart.  giving true revelation. 

Jesus was not joking when He said you must be Born again. We need the Holy Spirit to guide us always

Only  those who are truly of the Spirit will understand what I just sad.

[RB]

If anything , we need the Holy Spirits divine guidance for understanding as we pray on what we read.

Yes, this is true Rella~The gentleman that started this thread is senile, past understanding the simplest of truth...so what do we expect from such men? Not much. The holy apostle believed otherwise and that is what moved him to pray for all saints this precious prayer that ALL of us stand in desperate need of:

Ephesians 1:16-18~"Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers; That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him: The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,"

Now you know why this fellow has so much trouble with simple scriptures~ he's relying on his own abilities to understand the hidden mysteries of the word of God, ONLY given to those who trust God to open their understanding, without which, no man can see.   

[chosenone]

Well being that we all have the HS inside us if we are believers, God clearly thinks differently.

[wincam]

Joh 17:20  Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
Joh 17:21  That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:22  And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
Joh 17:23  I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
Joh 17:24  Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
Joh 17:25  O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:26  And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
Joh 16:12  I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
Joh 16:13  Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
Joh 16:14  He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
Joh 16:15  All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

"No Holy Ghost needed – we have the Scriptures"


Without ears to hear and eyes to see they study the Scripture in vain.
Never knowing the Father Son or Spirit, unable to understand Scripture.
Under a veil of darkness.
Lord have mercy.

is all this a revelation from the Holy Ghost or from Scriptures - this was not available to the Apostles, Disciples and early and early Christians but the HS was - wincam

[wincam]

Wincam, they had Genesis-Malachi. What do you think the Bereans studied to confirm their teaching?

they were not comparing the NT with the OT which was not available to them as it is to us - the NT is hidden in the OT and the OT is revealed in the NT - wincam

[LexKnight]

Wincam, they had Genesis-Malachi. What do you think the Bereans studied to confirm their teaching?

they were not comparing the NT with the OT which was not available to them as it is to us - the NT is hidden in the OT and the OT is revealed in the NT - wincam

I agree, yet would also say the OT has a lot more meat than the NT.

[skeeter]

Wincam, they had Genesis-Malachi. What do you think the Bereans studied to confirm their teaching?

they were not comparing the NT with the OT which was not available to them as it is to us - the NT is hidden in the OT and the OT is revealed in the NT - wincam

what are you trying to say here?
the Bereans did use the OT (that they had) to check the truth of what Paul taught them.  Do you do that with what the RCC teaches you? do you check what is found in the CCC  against what is in scripture?

[AVZ]

Wincam, they had Genesis-Malachi. What do you think the Bereans studied to confirm their teaching?

they were not comparing the NT with the OT which was not available to them as it is to us - the NT is hidden in the OT and the OT is revealed in the NT - wincam

what are you trying to say here?
the Bereans did use the OT (that they had) to check the truth of what Paul taught them.  Do you do that with what the RCC teaches you? do you check what is found in the CCC  against what is in scripture?

Catholics can't do that because an awful lot of the CT (Catholic Testament) cannot be found in neither OT nor NT.

Quite logically therefore the leadership of the RCC teaches that only they have the Holy Spirit passed down the lines of the apostles, and the rest of the flock has to obey.

[kensington]

I wonder which catechism that Wincam reads, because the one the CC uses says they received the Holy Spirit at either Baptism or at confirmation. 

If he says we don't need it or that God doesn't send it to us now, he is deeply in error... even according to his own church.

[skeeter]

Wincam, they had Genesis-Malachi. What do you think the Bereans studied to confirm their teaching?

they were not comparing the NT with the OT which was not available to them as it is to us - the NT is hidden in the OT and the OT is revealed in the NT - wincam

what are you trying to say here?
the Bereans did use the OT (that they had) to check the truth of what Paul taught them.  Do you do that with what the RCC teaches you? do you check what is found in the CCC  against what is in scripture?

Catholics can't do that because an awful lot of the CT (Catholic Testament) cannot be found in neither OT nor NT.

Quite logically therefore the leadership of the RCC teaches that only they have the Holy Spirit passed down the lines of the apostles, and the rest of the flock has to obey.

This is true but many don't even care when they do find out what the RCC teaches isn't in the OT or NT.  That often happens on forums and they say that the RCC got its power and authority from Christ so it doesn't matter that what they teach isn't in the Bible. 

[wincam]

of course that is so and the Bible tells us exactly why what is written was written and why what is written must be accepted including Jn.6:51-71 - wincam

[skeeter]

of course that is so and the Bible tells us exactly why what is written was written and why what is written must be accepted including Jn.6:51-71 - wincam

who are you responding to wincam?

[AVZ]

of course that is so and the Bible tells us exactly why what is written was written and why what is written must be accepted including Jn.6:51-71 - wincam

who are you responding to wincam?

Talking to himself

[wincam]

It is the Holy sprit that brings us into all truth concerning the word of God  With out the anointing of the Holy Spirit the Bible is just another book that  says a lot of religious things, but it is only carnal knowledge. Only the Holy Spirit reveals Christ in the heart.  giving true revelation. 

Jesus was not joking when He said you must be Born again. We need the Holy Spirit to guide us always

Only  those who are truly of the Spirit will understand what I just sad.

sad indeed that those who claim inspiration from and via blaspheme against the HS by attributing their confusion, contradictions, and divisions to Him - twinc

[His Kid]

it has not been realised that the Holy Spirit was given to the Apostles and early Christians as they did not have the scriptures as we do to search to see if these things be so - see Jn.14:16,17and 26 and 15:26 and 16:7 and 13 - wincam

The Holy Spirit abides in me.

[Hexalpa]

it has not been realised that the Holy Spirit was given to the Apostles and early Christians as they did not have the scriptures as we do to search to see if these things be so - see Jn.14:16,17and 26 and 15:26 and 16:7 and 13 - wincam

I have heard this argument from a idiot religious mate pushing just such a load of worldly trash, fact is without the Holy Spirit you have nothing in Christ.
Such push a dead Jesus.
Such idolise the so called Jews.
Such are happy to create wars for their own worldly ends.
Such believe they will be raptured up out of the mess they and other demons created.

[doorknocker]

it has not been realised that the Holy Spirit was given to the Apostles and early Christians as they did not have the scriptures as we do to search to see if these things be so - see Jn.14:16,17and 26 and 15:26 and 16:7 and 13 - wincam

The Holy Spirit abides in me.

[Ladonia]

Wincam, they had Genesis-Malachi. What do you think the Bereans studied to confirm their teaching?

they were not comparing the NT with the OT which was not available to them as it is to us - the NT is hidden in the OT and the OT is revealed in the NT - wincam

what are you trying to say here?
the Bereans did use the OT (that they had) to check the truth of what Paul taught them.  Do you do that with what the RCC teaches you? do you check what is found in the CCC  against what is in scripture?

Catholics can't do that because an awful lot of the CT (Catholic Testament) cannot be found in neither OT nor NT.

Quite logically therefore the leadership of the RCC teaches that only they have the Holy Spirit passed down the lines of the apostles, and the rest of the flock has to obey.

This is true but many don't even care when they do find out what the RCC teaches isn't in the OT or NT.  That often happens on forums and they say that the RCC got its power and authority from Christ so it doesn't matter that what they teach isn't in the Bible.

The Bible is simply not the only authority man has for the teachings of God.

[kensington]

I'd rather stand before God and say I trusted the Word of God rather than I trusted other sources by man.

[bemark]

It's like saying no need for petrol we have the car.

[RB]

The Bible is simply not the only authority man has for the teachings of God.

Oh, how precious is your insight! Do you know the definition of "Hearsay"? Information received from other people that one cannot adequately substantiate; rumor; Idle talk; •Law.... the report of another person's words by a witness, usually disallowed as evidence because it cannot be proven!

The Bible is simply not the only authority man has for the teachings of God

"that's all hearsay, and I don't care to listen to such tripe" No wise Judge would ever allow hearsay in as TRUTH....neither do faithful saints allow hearsay in as TRUTH. 

[Texas Conservative]

Yep.

We gots The Pope

[doorknocker]

quote author=RB link=topic=90778.msg1055008815#msg1055008815 date=1452509997]

The Bible is simply not the only authority man has for the teachings of God.

Oh, how precious is your insight! Do you know the definition of "Hearsay"? Information received from other people that one cannot adequately substantiate; rumor; Idle talk; •Law.... the report of another person's words by a witness, usually disallowed as evidence because it cannot be proven!

The Bible is simply not the only authority man has for the teachings of God

"that's all hearsay, and I don't care to listen to such tripe" No wise Judge would ever allow hearsay in as TRUTH....neither do faithful saints allow hearsay in as TRUTH.
[/quote]








The scriptures might disagree with you on that one.



These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you.

But the ANOINTING which ye have received of Him abideth in you, and ye not

that any man teach you, but as the same ANOINTING teacheth you of all things,

and is TRUTH, and is no lie, and even as IT has taught you, ye shall abide in Him.


It is written in the prophets......

And they shall be all taught of God.  Every man therefore that has heard, and

has learned of the Father,  cometh unto Me.


But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in My Name,

HE SHALL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS.



So your statement is not correct unless you equate the Spirit of the living God

as being the scriptures.



This is what Jesus had to say to the religious of His day...

And ye have not His Word abiding in you, for whom He hath sent, 

Him you believe not.

SEARCH THE SCRIPTURES,  FOR IN THEM YE THINK YE HAVE ETERNAL LIFE,

AND THEY ARE WHICH TESTIFY OF ME.

And ye will not COME TO ME, THAT YE MIGHT HAVE LIFE.

[Ladonia]

Yep.

We gots The Pope

Not just the Pope, but the whole Church that has it's place in the teaching of God's word.

[His Kid]

Yep.

We gots The Pope

Not just the Pope, but the whole Church that has it's place in the teaching of God's word.

The Holy Spirit literally abides in believers. We don't need a pope or a religion. We have the real thing.

Romans 8
9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. 10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

[Ladonia]

quote author=RB link=topic=90778.msg1055008815#msg1055008815 date=1452509997]

The Bible is simply not the only authority man has for the teachings of God.

Oh, how precious is your insight! Do you know the definition of "Hearsay"? Information received from other people that one cannot adequately substantiate; rumor; Idle talk; •Law.... the report of another person's words by a witness, usually disallowed as evidence because it cannot be proven!

The Bible is simply not the only authority man has for the teachings of God

"that's all hearsay, and I don't care to listen to such tripe" No wise Judge would ever allow hearsay in as TRUTH....neither do faithful saints allow hearsay in as TRUTH.

The scriptures might disagree with you on that one.



These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you.

But the ANOINTING which ye have received of Him abideth in you, and ye not

that any man teach you, but as the same ANOINTING teacheth you of all things,

and is TRUTH, and is no lie, and even as IT has taught you, ye shall abide in Him.


It is written in the prophets......

And they shall be all taught of God.  Every man therefore that has heard, and

has learned of the Father,  cometh unto Me.


But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in My Name,

HE SHALL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS.



So your statement is not correct unless you equate the Spirit of the living God

as being the scriptures.



This is what Jesus had to say to the religious of His day...

And ye have not His Word abiding in you, for whom He hath sent, 

Him you believe not.

SEARCH THE SCRIPTURES,  FOR IN THEM YE THINK YE HAVE ETERNAL LIFE,

AND THEY ARE WHICH TESTIFY OF ME.

And ye will not COME TO ME, THAT YE MIGHT HAVE LIFE.
[/quote]

Oh really? Consider this Batman. All the books in the world could not contain ALL that Jesus said and did. Then there is "tradition" which St. Paul wrote clearly about that is also to be considered and respected.  We should not forget about "the Church" either that should be recognized too and the authority given to it by Jesus Christ himself. And yes, we should search the Scriptures, but they themselves do not offer eternal life, only Jesus does that.

[Ladonia]

Yep.

We gots The Pope

Not just the Pope, but the whole Church that has it's place in the teaching of God's word.

The Holy Spirit literally abides in believers. We don't need a pope or a religion. We have the real thing.

Romans 8
9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. 10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

I can partly agree with you here. The Holy Spirit does indeed reside in all believers PLUS the Church that exists here on earth for our benefit. Without the Holy Spirit we would have a tough time indeed as we go through our spiritual lives.

[His Kid]

Yep.

We gots The Pope

Not just the Pope, but the whole Church that has it's place in the teaching of God's word.

The Holy Spirit literally abides in believers. We don't need a pope or a religion. We have the real thing.

Romans 8
9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. 10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

I can partly agree with you here. The Holy Spirit does indeed reside in all believers PLUS the Church that exists here on earth for our benefit. Without the Holy Spirit we would have a tough time indeed as we go through our spiritual lives.

I couldn't disagree more. My walk with the Lord is so much better since I left the Catholic church. Religion just mucks everything up.

[AVZ]

Then there is "tradition" which St. Paul wrote clearly about that is also to be considered and respected.

Is that the "tradition" of which Paul says "stand firm and hold to the traditions that you were taught by us, either by our spoken word or by our letter" and of which the Catholic Church has absolutely no proof whatsoever that they were actually taught by the apostles?

[RB]

So your statement is not correct unless you equate the Spirit of the living God as being the scriptures.

DK, were you speaking to me? I was speaking to Ladonia, to what he had said with these words:

Quote from: Ladonia on January 10, 2016, 10:07:22 PM: The Bible is simply not the only authority man has for the teachings of God

And I said to him, which he has yet to answer:

Oh, how precious is your insight! Do you know the definition of "Hearsay"? Information received from other people that one cannot adequately substantiate; rumor; Idle talk; •Law.... the report of another person's words by a witness, usually disallowed as evidence because it cannot be proven!

So, are you saying that the Spirit speaks to us apart from the written word of God, and that would be above the written scriptures that saints consider to be the only testimony that God has given to us as the final authority? Would you care to answer this post to clear the matter? Your post has me thinking you do.