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why a title like this?

are you sure your calling and election is sure?

lets read a verse that happened on judgement day

are you sure your calling and election is sure?

2 Peter 1:10
Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

why am I suppose to be diligent to make my calling and election sure?

what happened to these people concerning the calling and election?

Matthew 7

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

The Lord said not everyone who confess his name Lord Lord(Jesus) will enter into the kingdom?

yet we have doctrines that teach all we have to do is call o his name and we shall be saved.

Matthew 7

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity

these people thought for sure they were doing God's will.

these people had to wait until judgement day to find out that they were wrong and there calling was not sure.

is your salvation sure?
are you sure you are saved?
are you sure you are born again?
who called you to God?

before anyone of us can answer this we should read what Paul has to say first.

Romans 10

But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

9That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

11For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

12For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

13For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

14How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

15And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

16But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

17So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.


we have to hear God's words first before we know or assume that we are

is your salvation sure?
are you sure you are saved?
are you sure you are born again?


are you really sure that you fit all these criteria that the denominations teach?

did the People in Matthew 7 hear the truth?

were they saved?
did they get salvation?
where they born again?
who called them?

Mattew 7 is a warning to us today

Matthew 7

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity

these people thought they would be saved
these people thought they would obtain salvation
these people thought they would be born again
these people called upon the Lord's name
these people found out there reward on JUDGEMENT DAY.

understand what happened on this day to these people

are you sure you are born again?

Peter said

1 Peter 1:23
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Jesus said

John 3:3
Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

when do this man know that he is born from a corruptible seed to a incorruptible seed?

Psalm 3:8
Salvation belongeth unto the LORD: thy blessing is upon thy people. Selah.

on judgement day the people in Matthew 7 did not get the Lord's salvation

listen to the Lord's rejection of these people

Matthew 7

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity

Jesu said

Matthew 24:13
But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

the people below was judged on judgement day, is this the end?


Matthew 7

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity

Quote from: howard on Mon Oct 24, 2011 - 08:10:41

are you sure your calling and election is sure?

2 Peter 1:10
Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

why am I suppose to be diligent to make my calling and election sure?

what happened to these people concerning the calling and election?

Matthew 7

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

The Lord said not everyone who confess his name Lord Lord(Jesus) will enter into the kingdom?

yet we have doctrines that teach all we have to do is call o his name and we shall be saved.

Howard---

Unfortuantely you are combining two groups of verses that do not belong together.  When Peter says "Brethren---make your calling and election sure" he is speaking to saved Christians.  He is telling them to stand firm in their salvation and not stray away.  2 Peter 1:10 is directed to saved people.

Matthew 7:21,22 is directed at people who were never saved.  We know this because Jesus says "I NEVER KNEW YOU" yet the Bible says that God "KNOWS THOSE THAT ARE HIS".  Since He NEVER knew them, they are not Christians.

Dear brother Howard,
fish153 is right, Jesus was speaking to people who, even though they may have believed they were doing what He would have wanted them to do, were not 'KNOWN' by Him. Jesus knows us not by what we do for Him, but by our faithful recognition and acknowledgement of Him. This leads, many times, to a commitment to 'serve' Him and in that service we may do those things described in Matthew 7:22. Without all this we are merely trying to 'buy' our way into heaven. Something, that in God's eyes, we are not worthy of.
May you never have doubts about your relationship with Jesus.
Your brother in Christ, LeRoy (thefixer). 

We are not saved until the end. It isn't over till it's over.

It is He who endures to the end who will be saved. This is a futristic verse. It is something yet to come.

If we are still alive in the world we are not yet at the end and we are not yet saved - however we are followers of Christ.

We are told to examine ourselves to see whether or not we are in the faith.  2 Corinthians 13:5

Popular teachings today would have us believe that once we're saved we can never turn away from Christ and forfeit our salvation. This is a false and dangerous teaching that can and has lead people down a dangerous path.

IF we endure to the end with Him, then we will be saved.
IF we abide in Him, He will abide in us.
IF we do not deny Him before men, He will not deny us and confess us before the angels and before the Father.

We have the assurance NOW of salvation! What a terrible and stressful existence without the assurance that Jesus gives!

Luke 19:9
Jesus responded, "Salvation has come to this home today, for this man has shown himself to be a true son of Abraham.

2 Corinthians 6:2
For God says,"At just the right time, I heard you. On the day of salvation, I helped you.

Quote from: fish153 on Mon Oct 24, 2011 - 14:49:02


.......God "KNOWS THOSE THAT ARE HIS".  Since He NEVER knew them, they are not Christians.

.......GOD knowing who they are is one thing - themselves NOT KNOWING they are not true Christians is quite another !
And such is the dilemma some people (sadly the many) are in even today.
Scripture says satan deceives the whole world therefore we are all deceived UNTIL we are called and taken out of this deceived world.
From Howard's quotes can be seen that 'the many are still deceived even while thinking/believing they are not.
How can we be SURE of our calling and election ? THERE IS A WAY !!!

Quote from: Sinead on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 00:54:36
We are not saved until the end. It isn't over till it's over.

It is He who endures to the end who will be saved. This is a futristic verse. It is something yet to come.

If we are still alive in the world we are not yet at the end and we are not yet saved - however we are followers of Christ.

We are told to examine ourselves to see whether or not we are in the faith.  2 Corinthians 13:5

Popular teachings today would have us believe that once we're saved we can never turn away from Christ and forfeit our salvation. This is a false and dangerous teaching that can and has lead people down a dangerous path.

IF we endure to the end with Him, then we will be saved.
IF we abide in Him, He will abide in us.
IF we do not deny Him before men, He will not deny us and confess us before the angels and before the Father.

Good post Sinead !!!
To be finally 'saved is always a future event and things can go wrong in the meantime.....similar to a 'pregnancy. When we are conceived/begotten we are not then 'born. A period of 'development must take place which some 'Christians totally disregard believing themselves to be already born again.
However....there are ways and means to make our calling and election sure....but it can not be rushed or taken for granted...as 'many do.

Quote from: Lively Stone on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 01:35:11
We have the assurance NOW of salvation! What a terrible and stressful existence without the assurance that Jesus gives!

Luke 19:9
Jesus responded, "Salvation has come to this home today, for this man has shown himself to be a true son of Abraham.

2 Corinthians 6:2
For God says,"At just the right time, I heard you. On the day of salvation, I helped you.

Quote from: Beta on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 03:11:45

Quote from: Sinead on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 00:54:36
We are not saved until the end. It isn't over till it's over.

It is He who endures to the end who will be saved. This is a futristic verse. It is something yet to come.

If we are still alive in the world we are not yet at the end and we are not yet saved - however we are followers of Christ.

We are told to examine ourselves to see whether or not we are in the faith.  2 Corinthians 13:5

Popular teachings today would have us believe that once we're saved we can never turn away from Christ and forfeit our salvation. This is a false and dangerous teaching that can and has lead people down a dangerous path.

IF we endure to the end with Him, then we will be saved.
IF we abide in Him, He will abide in us.
IF we do not deny Him before men, He will not deny us and confess us before the angels and before the Father.

Good post Sinead !!!
To be finally 'saved is always a future event and things can go wrong in the meantime.....similar to a 'pregnancy. When we are conceived/begotten we are not then 'born. A period of 'development must take place which some 'Christians totally disregard believing themselves to be already born again.
However....there are ways and means to make our calling and election sure....but it can not be rushed or taken for granted...as 'many do.

Beta/Sinead----

Think about something if you will.  The Bible mentions in many places about "the joy of salvation".  Let me ask a question:  How can you possibly rejoice in something you are never sure you have?  If you don't believe you will know until the end how can you possibly "rejoice in salvation"?

When a person is SAVED from drowning they are thankful and they rejoice.  The salvation is ACCOMPLISHED--they are safe. In fact, they jump up and down with joy that they are still alive, and embrace with great joy the ones that saved them.    

But if they were still in the water, flailing and hoping someone comes to retrieve them from the water can they rejoice?  If they are only hoping that sometime in the future someone might save them from their plight are they filled with joy and thankfulness?  Of course not. The "might be" limits all joy.

I just posted this verse in another thread---but here it is again:

"These things I write onto you that you may KNOW that you HAVE eternal life" (1 John 5:13)

Now---that's something to jump up and down about!!  That is something to rejoice in!  We can KNOW that we HAVE eternal life NOW!!  Was John the Apostle being presumptuous for stating such a thing?  No---he was stating a fact, and WANTED Christians to rejoice in THEIR SALVATION.

Simply put. We know we are serving Jesus when we know we are being led of the spirit after being born again of Gods spirit. We are no longer using human reasoning but trusting in Gods character, Gods word and want to be with others who love God the same way.

Even simpler, we love God if we love. Especially those fellow believers who love God. But also love their enemies, praying for those who persecute them.

We are transformed, by the renewing of our minds, become thankful forever more.

Quote from: INJ on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 15:00:34
Simply put. We know we are serving Jesus when we know we are being led of the spirit after being born again of Gods spirit. We are no longer using human reasoning but trusting in Gods character, Gods word and want to be with others who love God the same way.

Even simpler, we love God if we love. Especially those fellow believers who love God. But also love their enemies, praying for those who persecute them.

We are transformed, by the renewing of our minds, become thankful forever more.

And how do we know we have the Spirit of God ?
Acts 5v32, Heb.5v9 explain : when we are obedient to God.

And how do we show our love to God ?
1Joh.5v3 this is the love of God that we keep his Commandments...
1Jon.2v4 he that says 'I know him and keeps not his Commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him.

Both points you raised have scriptural answers that make clear what God wants .
Anyone doing the Will of God is not condemned. Simple !

Quote from: fish153 on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 14:48:40

Beta/Sinead----

Think about something if you will.  The Bible mentions in many places about "the joy of salvation".  Let me ask a question:  How can you possibly rejoice in something you are never sure you have?  If you don't believe you will know until the end how can you possibly "rejoice in salvation"?

When a person is SAVED from drowning they are thankful and they rejoice.  The salvation is ACCOMPLISHED--they are safe. In fact, they jump up and down with joy that they are still alive, and embrace with great joy the ones that saved them.    

But if they were still in the water, flailing and hoping someone comes to retrieve them from the water can they rejoice?  If they are only hoping that sometime in the future someone might save them from their plight are they filled with joy and thankfulness?  Of course not. The "might be" limits all joy.

I just posted this verse in another thread---but here it is again:

"These things I write onto you that you may KNOW that you HAVE eternal life" (1 John 5:13)

Now---that's something to jump up and down about!!  That is something to rejoice in!  We can KNOW that we HAVE eternal life NOW!!  Was John the Apostle being presumptuous for stating such a thing?  No---he was stating a fact, and WANTED Christians to rejoice in THEIR SALVATION.

Yes fish I know what scripture says re eternal life...but do the majority of christians KNOW ? Apparently MANY do NOT...... or they would not find themselves in Mat.7v21-23.
Just reading scripture and applying it to yourself is not the right way to go about getting saved....MANY think it is and will be bitterly disappointed.
While we are still in the flesh we are struggling in the water....not without hope (as you make out) but not fully saved either. Christ is already saving us if we follow/obey his instructions to the end.

Quote from: fish153 on Mon Oct 24, 2011 - 14:49:02

Quote from: howard on Mon Oct 24, 2011 - 08:10:41

are you sure your calling and election is sure?

2 Peter 1:10
Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

why am I suppose to be diligent to make my calling and election sure?

what happened to these people concerning the calling and election?

Matthew 7

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

The Lord said not everyone who confess his name Lord Lord(Jesus) will enter into the kingdom?

yet we have doctrines that teach all we have to do is call o his name and we shall be saved.

Howard---

Unfortuantely you are combining two groups of verses that do not belong together.  When Peter says "Brethren---make your calling and election sure" he is speaking to saved Christians.  He is telling them to stand firm in their salvation and not stray away.  2 Peter 1:10 is directed to saved people.

Matthew 7:21,22 is directed at people who were never saved.  We know this because Jesus says "I NEVER KNEW YOU" yet the Bible says that God "KNOWS THOSE THAT ARE HIS".  Since He NEVER knew them, they are not Christians.

Fish

these people in Matthew 7 are people of yesterday, today and in the future, these people had to wait until JUDGEMENTS day to find out that they did not make it into God's kingdom.

from the time they first accepted Jesus, because in there mind they thought they was doing it right, until that time of death and Judgement day they read Peter and thought they were included in with the brethren or a christian.

unfortunately

they had to find out on judgement day that they are not the brethren or christian

the verses go together up until judgement day.  

this is when the verse separate.

did they make there calling and election sure

they thought they did.

Quote from: thefixer on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 00:32:54
Dear brother Howard,
fish153 is right, Jesus was speaking to people who, even though they may have believed they were doing what He would have wanted them to do, were not 'KNOWN' by Him. Jesus knows us not by what we do for Him, but by our faithful recognition and acknowledgement of Him. This leads, many times, to a commitment to 'serve' Him and in that service we may do those things described in Matthew 7:22. Without all this we are merely trying to 'buy' our way into heaven. Something, that in God's eyes, we are not worthy of.
May you never have doubts about your relationship with Jesus.
Your brother in Christ, LeRoy (thefixer). 

I dont have doubts brother, what I have is questions

I have to question you comment and here is why

lets read some more of Jesus reply to these people and us

  21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

its obvious these people did not do the will of Jesus
its clear that they did the will of someone else who they thought was the will of Jesus

this verse goes against your post

Jesus has something he wants us to do and it is his will that we do it.

Quote from: Sinead on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 00:54:36
We are not saved until the end. It isn't over till it's over.

It is He who endures to the end who will be saved. This is a futristic verse. It is something yet to come.

If we are still alive in the world we are not yet at the end and we are not yet saved - however we are followers of Christ.

We are told to examine ourselves to see whether or not we are in the faith.  2 Corinthians 13:5

Popular teachings today would have us believe that once we're saved we can never turn away from Christ and forfeit our salvation. This is a false and dangerous teaching that can and has lead people down a dangerous path.

IF we endure to the end with Him, then we will be saved.
IF we abide in Him, He will abide in us.
IF we do not deny Him before men, He will not deny us and confess us before the angels and before the Father.

it is refreshing to hear someone actaully confess and believe what is written in God's words


Matthew 7

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

people are not hearing the saying of Jesus

they are not hearing these words

Matthe 24

  13But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Quote from: Lively Stone on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 01:35:11
We have the assurance NOW of salvation! What a terrible and stressful existence without the assurance that Jesus gives!

Luke 19:9
Jesus responded, "Salvation has come to this home today, for this man has shown himself to be a true son of Abraham.

2 Corinthians 6:2
For God says,"At just the right time, I heard you. On the day of salvation, I helped you.

Quote from: Beta on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 03:11:45

Quote from: Sinead on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 00:54:36
We are not saved until the end. It isn't over till it's over.

It is He who endures to the end who will be saved. This is a futristic verse. It is something yet to come.

If we are still alive in the world we are not yet at the end and we are not yet saved - however we are followers of Christ.

We are told to examine ourselves to see whether or not we are in the faith.  2 Corinthians 13:5

Popular teachings today would have us believe that once we're saved we can never turn away from Christ and forfeit our salvation. This is a false and dangerous teaching that can and has lead people down a dangerous path.

IF we endure to the end with Him, then we will be saved.
IF we abide in Him, He will abide in us.
IF we do not deny Him before men, He will not deny us and confess us before the angels and before the Father.

Good post Sinead !!!
To be finally 'saved is always a future event and things can go wrong in the meantime.....similar to a 'pregnancy. When we are conceived/begotten we are not then 'born. A period of 'development must take place which some 'Christians totally disregard believing themselves to be already born again.
However....there are ways and means to make our calling and election sure....but it can not be rushed or taken for granted...as 'many do.

amen

this one verse we all need to put it into our daily lives

listen ot what Solomon says here

Ecclesiastes 3:17
I said in mine heart, God shall judge the righteous and the wicked: for there is a time there for every purpose and for every work.

Quote from: fish153 on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 14:48:40

Quote from: Beta on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 03:11:45

Quote from: Sinead on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 00:54:36
We are not saved until the end. It isn't over till it's over.

It is He who endures to the end who will be saved. This is a futristic verse. It is something yet to come.

If we are still alive in the world we are not yet at the end and we are not yet saved - however we are followers of Christ.

We are told to examine ourselves to see whether or not we are in the faith.  2 Corinthians 13:5

Popular teachings today would have us believe that once we're saved we can never turn away from Christ and forfeit our salvation. This is a false and dangerous teaching that can and has lead people down a dangerous path.

IF we endure to the end with Him, then we will be saved.
IF we abide in Him, He will abide in us.
IF we do not deny Him before men, He will not deny us and confess us before the angels and before the Father.

Good post Sinead !!!
To be finally 'saved is always a future event and things can go wrong in the meantime.....similar to a 'pregnancy. When we are conceived/begotten we are not then 'born. A period of 'development must take place which some 'Christians totally disregard believing themselves to be already born again.
However....there are ways and means to make our calling and election sure....but it can not be rushed or taken for granted...as 'many do.

Beta/Sinead----

Think about something if you will.  The Bible mentions in many places about "the joy of salvation".  Let me ask a question:  How can you possibly rejoice in something you are never sure you have?  If you don't believe you will know until the end how can you possibly "rejoice in salvation"?

When a person is SAVED from drowning they are thankful and they rejoice.  The salvation is ACCOMPLISHED--they are safe. In fact, they jump up and down with joy that they are still alive, and embrace with great joy the ones that saved them.   

But if they were still in the water, flailing and hoping someone comes to retrieve them from the water can they rejoice?  If they are only hoping that sometime in the future someone might save them from their plight are they filled with joy and thankfulness?  Of course not. The "might be" limits all joy.

I just posted this verse in another thread---but here it is again:

"These things I write onto you that you may KNOW that you HAVE eternal life" (1 John 5:13)

Now---that's something to jump up and down about!!  That is something to rejoice in!  We can KNOW that we HAVE eternal life NOW!!  Was John the Apostle being presumptuous for stating such a thing?  No---he was stating a fact, and WANTED Christians to rejoice in THEIR SALVATION.

how do you know?

how do you know when you have verse of warning from Jesus the prophets and Apostles

2 Corinthians 11:4
For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

How do you know unless God has told you already?

Peter said make your election sure and he said this

Acts 2:40
And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

and Paul said this

Philippians 2:12
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

Philippians 2:12
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.


Paul said work out your own salvation

we know Jesus is our salvation yet Paul lets us know that we have a hand in our salvation also

are you sure you are working on your own salvation until the Saviour comes?

Paul said;

But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. Romans 6:17 (KJV)

Wonder what he was talking about??

Quote from: howard on Wed Oct 26, 2011 - 09:26:34

Quote from: Lively Stone on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 01:35:11
We have the assurance NOW of salvation! What a terrible and stressful existence without the assurance that Jesus gives!

Luke 19:9
Jesus responded, "Salvation has come to this home today, for this man has shown himself to be a true son of Abraham.

2 Corinthians 6:2
For God says,"At just the right time, I heard you. On the day of salvation, I helped you.

Quote from: Lively Stone on Wed Oct 26, 2011 - 10:59:27

Quote from: howard on Wed Oct 26, 2011 - 09:26:34

Quote from: Lively Stone on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 01:35:11
We have the assurance NOW of salvation! What a terrible and stressful existence without the assurance that Jesus gives!

Luke 19:9
Jesus responded, "Salvation has come to this home today, for this man has shown himself to be a true son of Abraham.

2 Corinthians 6:2
For God says,"At just the right time, I heard you. On the day of salvation, I helped you.

Quote from: howard on Mon Oct 24, 2011 - 08:05:30

responding to the topic, i'm not serving Jesus, bcause Jesus NEVER taught ANYONE to serve him. Jesus said he teach what his Father wants him to,(John 15:15 Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you).

also to serve one is to do their will,Jesus even said it's NOT his will he's doing ,(John 5:30 -I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me).

so all that Jesus taught was what his Father wanted him to teach. which mean WE... are to serve ONLY his Father, Jesus said so! (Matt.7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven).  and 

(Matt.12:50-For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother).

Jesus showed only those acknowledging his Father,were sent to Jesus.
(John 6:44,45- No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me).

Jesus words shows...we must know  AND learn about his Father. though many are teaching falsely to serve Jesus. those who say they serve him, really is ignoring his words. i believe Jesus, and HIS teachings, instead of what any "church" leader wants me to believe. any who says i'm wrong for NOT serving Jesus. needs to take it to him, because he told us who to serve...his Father. peace

Quote from: jojo50 on Wed Oct 26, 2011 - 15:32:39

Quote from: howard on Mon Oct 24, 2011 - 08:05:30

responding to the topic, i'm not serving Jesus, bcause Jesus NEVER taught ANYONE to serve him. Jesus said he teach what his Father wants him to,(John 15:15 Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you).

also to serve one is to do their will,Jesus even said it's NOT his will he's doing ,(John 5:30 -I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me).

so all that Jesus taught was what his Father wanted him to teach. which mean WE... are to serve ONLY his Father, Jesus said so! (Matt.7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven).  and 

(Matt.12:50-For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother).

Jesus showed only those acknowledging his Father,were sent to Jesus.
(John 6:44,45- No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me).

Jesus words shows...we must know  AND learn about his Father. though many are teaching falsely to serve Jesus. those who say they serve him, really is ignoring his words. i believe Jesus, and HIS teachings, instead of what any "church" leader wants me to believe. any who says i'm wrong for NOT serving Jesus. needs to take it to him, because he told us who to serve...his Father. peace

Jesus was the servant of all and said if anyone wants to be greatest in the kingdom we need to learn to serve. Serving is an act of love in the Kingdom of God rather than a demand. Whatever we do to our brethren we have done to Jesus.

Quote from: yogi bear on Wed Oct 26, 2011 - 09:43:08
Paul said;

But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. Romans 6:17 (KJV)

Wonder what he was talking about??

what is he saying?

lets read a little more to find out

12Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.

13Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

14For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

15What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

16Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

17But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.

18Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

19I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.

20For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.



sounds like this mortal man has a choice and struggles between sin and righteousness

it don't sound as thougth Paul is letting us know that we are saved.

when are we made free from sin?

when Jesus returns and gives us our immortal body

Quote from: Lively Stone on Wed Oct 26, 2011 - 10:59:27

Quote from: howard on Wed Oct 26, 2011 - 09:26:34

Quote from: Lively Stone on Tue Oct 25, 2011 - 01:35:11
We have the assurance NOW of salvation! What a terrible and stressful existence without the assurance that Jesus gives!

Luke 19:9
Jesus responded, “Salvation has come to this home today, for this man has shown himself to be a true son of Abraham.

2 Corinthians 6:2
For God says,“At just the right time, I heard you. On the day of salvation, I helped you.” Indeed, the “right time” is now. Today is the day of salvation.

Colossians 1:27
For God wanted them to know that the riches and glory of Christ are for you Gentiles, too. And this is the secret: Christ lives in you. This gives you assurance of sharing his glory.

Hebrews 10:22
Let us all come forward and draw near with true (honest and sincere) hearts in unqualified assurance and absolute conviction engendered by faith (by that leaning of the entire human personality on God in absolute trust and confidence in His power, wisdom, and goodness), having our hearts sprinkled and purified from a guilty (evil) conscience and our bodies cleansed with pure water.

1 John 3:21
And, beloved, if our consciences (our hearts) do not accuse us [if they do not make us feel guilty and condemn us], we have confidence (complete assurance and boldness) before God,

Jesus is salvation to come, he is our salvation.

when does he come?

so do we have it now or do we wait for salvation to come?

the righteous man is a christian(in Jesus) yet he turneth from his righteousness(in Jesus)
what happened to his salvation now that he did not turn back to righteousness or endured unto the end?


Ezekiel 18

25Yet ye say, The way of the LORD is not equal. Hear now, O house of Israel; Is not my way equal? are not your ways unequal?

26When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and death in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die.

The scriptures say we have salvation NOW.

who has salvation now?

the one who endure in Jesus until the end  ot the one who was never in Jesus or who was in and cluld not run the race to the end and fell away?

who has salvation now?

and how do you know?

Quoteauthor=INJ link=topic=58777.msg1054628802#msg1054628802 date=1319572834]
Simply put. We know we are serving Jesus when we know we are being led of the spirit after being born again of Gods spirit.

the Word says

1 John 4:1
Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

can I try your spirit since you know? How do I know you are led by the spirit of God when the Word says that another Jesus is among us?

QuoteWe are no longer using human reasoning but trusting in Gods character, Gods word and want to be with others who love God the same way.

what is God character where is it written in the bible? 

QuoteEven simpler, we love God if we love. Especially those fellow believers who love God. But also love their enemies, praying for those who persecute them.

what is this love you speak of how do we beleivers know we love God and other where is the proof?

QuoteWe are transformed, by the renewing of our minds, become thankful forever more.

show me the verses on hoiw to renew our mind?

HOW?

to many holes inyour post.

Read the bible, believe the bible, and be baptized.