Christian Forums

Quote from: segell on Fri Dec 09, 2011 - 09:13:54

Quote from: Insight on Thu Dec 08, 2011 - 15:02:11

Quote from: segell on Thu Dec 08, 2011 - 09:02:17

Quote from: Insight on Wed Dec 07, 2011 - 16:01:55

Quote from: segell on Wed Dec 07, 2011 - 09:15:04

Quote from: Insight on Tue Dec 06, 2011 - 16:03:08

Quote from: segell on Tue Dec 06, 2011 - 13:05:53
Insight, is your teaching/wisdom self taught or are you a student of a particular person's/group's teaching?  Would you share with us how you came to become so adament in your belief? I'm trying to get some context in terms of you and your teaching.  Frankly, I'm trying to determine whether to take your posts and you seriously.  Thanks.

Steve

Steve, I am not important, at all...just a voice.

Whether you listen or not is entirely up to you.

Insight

It appears that your voice is not really worth listening to.  One who is not able to answer questions directly is not a voice but rather a manipulator.  There is no light here, Insight.  Or you would want it to shine.

Steve,

Your understanding on the nature of Jesus is vastly different to that of the Apostle Paul's.  I appreciate your position in relation to hearing; I have no control over who you desire to listen to.  There are many questions here unanswered by Trinitarian doctrine and the nature of Christ is but one.

I have ask you to define exactly the nature of Christ during his probation and thus far you have not. Confusion reigns on this subject as a result of human philosophy running rampant through people's minds.

e.g. For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Paul refers to Jesus nature as sin's flesh and it is in that flesh that sin was condemned.

For sin to be condemned in the nature of Christ it had to be there first.

Your doctrine and teaching cannot explain this verse, to do so, would cause all your understanding of God's work of redemption in His Son to vanish in an instance.

Now I am able to not only understand this passage but reconcile it with all Scripture.

By the way, you would be surprised to see how many confessing Christians have tried to tackle this verse an failed miserably.

Will you join this group?

No.  There are others here who may wish to engage.  But, when you don't answer questions directly or choose to avoid answers or try to appear humble (by saying you are you are not important, just a voice and yet your words speak otherwise) there is really no reason to take you seriously because I'm not certain that you are a serious person. And, finally, your teaching is an anethema to the Gospel message.

Why should anyone take you seriously?

You say no but your words said "yes"

If you have nothing of substance to add to this thread maybe you could go over the numerous posts where questions have been unanswered and put them forth.

I am more than willing to address them.

Insight

Ok. Let's try this again.

"Insight, is your teaching/wisdom self taught or are you a student of a particular person's/group's teaching?  Would you share with us how you came to become so adament in your belief? I'm trying to get some context in terms of you and your teaching.  Frankly, I'm trying to determine whether to take your posts and you seriously.  Thanks."

Having come from a number of Christian churches over the years I came to realise the traditional interpretations were full of mythological influence. For the past 18 years I have studied the Scriptures, for myself, with only the KJV and Stongs concordance in hand. The Word needs to be approached as though you know nothing! Removing all bias and certainly rid yourself of all apostolic teaching which I consider mainstream.  A mind must be prepared to receive how the Spirit communicates through the written Word, a lost skill today.  There are certain keys and techniques God has used to hid wisdom within HIs Word.

Should you like me to show such a technique you only need ask?

Steve, you must be teachable to receive them.  So if you wanted to brand me self taught, I am ok with that, or taught of God through his Word of Truth, is how I like to appreciate my understanding.

Needless to say having understood the mainstream Christian message compared to the truth I and others now hold, yes I am very adamant of its substance and ability to lead my family and to salvation.

I believe in the original gospel that at the first was untouched by man and his creeds - it will do you well to find that original Gospel - pure in its message and powerful

Insight

Thanks for your response, Insight.  Real quick question:  what is the Good News message you have for us other than debunking what you believe to be errant apostolic teaching.  Is your understanding, having your understanding the key to salvation?  If not, what is the key to salvation?

Quote from: segell on Sat Dec 10, 2011 - 08:45:41
Thanks for your response, Insight.  Real quick question:  what is the Good News message you have for us other than debunking what you believe to be errant apostolic teaching.  Is your understanding, having your understanding the key to salvation?  If not, what is the key to salvation?

1. The things concerning the Kingdom of God (on earth)

2. The name of the Lord Jesus Christ

These are styled the two keys of the Gospel whereby each key is dealt with in the 1 & 2 Epistles of Peter.

The first key is suffering mentioned 21 times in the 1st epistle and the second key is the glory that shall follow.  Should a Christian not understand either of these two keys they can not be saved.

You will see I have highlighted the word "things" and "name" both are essential elements in the knowledge that leads to salvation (2 Tim 3:15,16)

Doctrines such as heaven going, hell (feiry place) going, immortal soulism, infant baptism, supernatural devils and demons etc are all errorist teachings born out of Egyptian, Greek & Roman influence.  Plato is held in high esteem by many Christian writers none more so than the RCC today.

Should you ever desire to know these things just ask.

Insight

Quote from: Insight on Sat Dec 10, 2011 - 17:29:06

Quote from: segell on Sat Dec 10, 2011 - 08:45:41
Thanks for your response, Insight.  Real quick question:  what is the Good News message you have for us other than debunking what you believe to be errant apostolic teaching.  Is your understanding, having your understanding the key to salvation?  If not, what is the key to salvation?

1. The things concerning the Kingdom of God (on earth)

2. The name of the Lord Jesus Christ

These are styled the two keys of the Gospel whereby each key is dealt with in the 1 & 2 Epistles of Peter.

The first key is suffering mentioned 21 times in the 1st epistle and the second key is the glory that shall follow.  Should a Christian not understand either of these two keys they can not be saved.

You will see I have highlighted the word "things" and "name" both are essential elements in the knowledge that leads to salvation (2 Tim 3:15,16)

Doctrines such as heaven going, hell (feiry place) going, immortal soulism, infant baptism, supernatural devils and demons etc are all errorist teachings born out of Egyptian, Greek & Roman influence.  Plato is held in high esteem by many Christian writers none more so than the RCC today.

Should you ever desire to know these things just ask.

Insight

Huh?  Sorry, I just have no desire.  It seems you don't have Good News to share. 

Frankly, John 3:16 does sum up the good news of God's love for you and I.  Hope you will be able to see that.  What you offer, Insight, is nothing to be considered, I'm afraid.  You just seem to be all over the place.  Narrow your focus on the Lord Jesus - well, that would be my suggestion and forget about all the other doctrinal stuff.....even yours. 

I wish you well.  Good bye.

Steve

Quote from: segell on Sun Dec 11, 2011 - 23:44:03

Quote from: Insight on Sat Dec 10, 2011 - 17:29:06

Quote from: segell on Sat Dec 10, 2011 - 08:45:41
Thanks for your response, Insight.  Real quick question:  what is the Good News message you have for us other than debunking what you believe to be errant apostolic teaching.  Is your understanding, having your understanding the key to salvation?  If not, what is the key to salvation?

1. The things concerning the Kingdom of God (on earth)

2. The name of the Lord Jesus Christ

These are styled the two keys of the Gospel whereby each key is dealt with in the 1 & 2 Epistles of Peter.

The first key is suffering mentioned 21 times in the 1st epistle and the second key is the glory that shall follow.  Should a Christian not understand either of these two keys they can not be saved.

You will see I have highlighted the word "things" and "name" both are essential elements in the knowledge that leads to salvation (2 Tim 3:15,16)

Doctrines such as heaven going, hell (feiry place) going, immortal soulism, infant baptism, supernatural devils and demons etc are all errorist teachings born out of Egyptian, Greek & Roman influence.  Plato is held in high esteem by many Christian writers none more so than the RCC today.

Should you ever desire to know these things just ask.

Insight

Huh?  Sorry, I just have no desire.  It seems you don't have Good News to share. 

Frankly, John 3:16 does sum up the good news of God's love for you and I.  Hope you will be able to see that.  What you offer, Insight, is nothing to be considered, I'm afraid.  You just seem to be all over the place.  Narrow your focus on the Lord Jesus - well, that would be my suggestion and forget about all the other doctrinal stuff.....even yours. 

I wish you well.  Good bye.

Steve

And it was night...

And, Insight, you have still not shared the Gospel or Good News that you say others do not have.  just what is your good news?  So far, you haven't shared any.  You've only shared your purported, self anointed wisdom.  Is that the good news?  Your ability to "get it"?  Again, so far, no good news has been shared by you.  None.  Respectfully, you really are not to be taken seriously - the very thing that seems to be most valued by you.

If you have no good news to share, you really have nothing to share.  Do you see where I'm coming from?

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 09:26:25
And, Insight, you have still not shared the Gospel or Good News that you say others do not have.  just what is your good news?  So far, you haven't shared any.  You've only shared your purported, self anointed wisdom.  Is that the good news?  Your ability to "get it"?  Again, so far, no good news has been shared by you.  None.  Respectfully, you really are not to be taken seriously - the very thing that seems to be most valued by you.

If you have no good news to share, you really have nothing to share.  Do you see where I'm coming from?

If you do not understand Jesus Christ's sufferings in the flesh; how will you enter those sufferings yourself? And if you know not the Glory that will follow how will you be ready to receive such Glory?    

Steve, you cannot explain to me the exact nature of Jesus Christ nor can you communicate precisely what he overcame.

And you ask me about the Good News?

Peter gives you the two keys of the Kingdom but you are so FULL of wrong doctrine you cannot think with clarity.

Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow. 1 Peter 1:11


Grab your E-Sword or whatever Bible program you use and search for suffering, suffer in 1st Peter

How many hits?

Now go and search the 2nd Peter for suffering, suffer

How many hits?

Now I have been "trying" to show you the sufferings of Christ, but you have resisted all the way...so if you do not want to know the 1st Key to unlock the knowledge of the coming Kingdom, so be it.  
At least you have been warned.

Insight

Still no Good News.  Just a self proclaimed understanding of a works oriented theology.  Prepare ourselves for glory?  Prepare ourselves?  Oh well....

Again, no Good News.  None.  No Gospel message.  None.  Just a self proclaimed deep understanding of a verse of Scripture.  It leads to nowhere other than ourselves and what we know and what we get.  It's all about "getting it right".

The Lord Jesus Christ is the One who got it all right!  The good news is that we can rest in His getting it right and in His righteousness. 

Sorry, Insight, there just isn't any insight there.  I believe your teaching actually is an anethema to the Gospel message and leads people away from instead of to the Cross.  It seems your focus is misplaced.

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 16:37:51
Still no Good News.  Just a self proclaimed understanding of a works oriented theology.  Prepare ourselves for glory?  Prepare ourselves?  Oh well....

Again, no Good News.  None.  No Gospel message.  None.  Just a self proclaimed deep understanding of a verse of Scripture.  It leads to nowhere other than ourselves and what we know and what we get.  It's all about "getting it right".

The Lord Jesus Christ is the One who got it all right!  The good news is that we can rest in His getting it right and in His righteousness. 

Sorry, Insight, there just isn't any insight there.  I believe your teaching actually is an anethema to the Gospel message and leads people away from instead of to the Cross.  It seems your focus is misplaced.

Not able to enter the Word I see.

So 1 Pete 1:11 was lost on you - you still do not understand the keys of the Kingdom and your reluctance to receive the Word with gladness is clear for all to see.

I will kick the dust off and move forward.

If at some stage you would like to discuss the sufferings of Christ and how one enters the saving name...

Just PM anytime.

I am always willing!

Insight

Thank you for the invitation.  But, with respect, Insight, you have offered up nothing. 

God bless you. 

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 16:43:04
Thank you for the invitation.  But, with respect, Insight, you have offered up nothing. 

God bless you. 

So 1 Peter 1:11 is nothing to you?

So be it.

That's really silly Insight and you have quite a manipulative manner.  The issue isn't the Scripture, it's your apparent inability to share any good news.  Which is not surprising, frankly. Because your message is not good news - it appears to be strictly self promotional and satisfying.

The fact that you, after being asked numerous times, failed to state or articulate the good news of the Gospel speaks volumes.  You and your understandings do not comprise the Gospel.  You have shared no good news.  That is the point.

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 16:57:53
That's really silly Insight and you have quite a manipulative manner.  The issue isn't the Scripture, it's your apparent inability to share any good news.  Which is not surprising, frankly. Because your message is not good news - it appears to be strictly self promotional and satisfying.

The fact that you, after being asked numerous times, failed to state or articulate the good news of the Gospel speaks volumes.  You and your understandings do not comprise the Gospel.  You have shared no good news.  That is the point.

Back tracking I see.

Sadly your soil is not tilled sufficiently to receive the Word with Joy.

Why dont you expound the two keys of the Kingdom for us and lets see where it leads us?

You resisted 1 Peter 1:11...

Clearly "you" say I have nothing to offer.

Insight

But here are some points to help you along the way.

Two Keys:

1. Sufferings of Christ

2. Glories of Christ

Then compare with Luke 24:26

Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?

If I asked you to provide the prophecies of his suffering and glories would you know where to go and how to expound them?

By the way did you notice in 1 Peter 1:11 both words for suffering(s) and Glory(s) are plural?

You speak as a fool Steve because you think you know the Good News of the Gospel but actually you know little, if nothing at all.

Can you list the various aspects of his sufferings? And how the Gospel allows us to enter those sufferings?  And do you know his Glories? And how that Glory will be received by those who know the true Gospel?

With your attitude why should you be taught anything?

Sadly if you know not the 2 Keys of the Kingdom how will you understand the Atonement of Salvation?

You have a long way to go Steve, a long way.

This is not about repenting Steve, its about a willingness to hear a saving message, which you think you already know!

Insight

So insight please tell us how you enter the Glory of God and how you allow the Glory of God to enter you.

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 17:33:07
But here are some points to help you along the way.

Two Keys:

1. Sufferings of Christ

2. Glories of Christ

Then compare with Luke 24:26

Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?

If I asked you to provide the prophecies of his suffering and glories would you know where to go and how to expound them?

By the way did you notice in 1 Peter 1:11 both words for suffering(s) and Glory(s) are plural?

You speak as a fool Steve because you think you know the Good News of the Gospel but actually you know little, if nothing at all.

Can you list the various aspects of his sufferings? And how the Gospel allows us to enter those sufferings?  And do you know his Glories? And how that Glory will be received by those who know the true Gospel?

With your attitude why should you be taught anything?

Sadly if you know not the 2 Keys of the Kingdom how will you understand the Atonement of Salvation?

You have a long way to go Steve, a long way.

This is not about repenting Steve, its about a willingness to hear a saving message, which you think you already know!

Insight

Again, you say nothing.  Again, no gospel or good news.  Insight, there is nothing to respond to.  Your message is really no message at all.  Sorry, in our exchanges you have not ever offered a saving message.  Nothing at all.

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:27:15

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 17:33:07
But here are some points to help you along the way.

Two Keys:

1. Sufferings of Christ

2. Glories of Christ

Then compare with Luke 24:26

Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?

If I asked you to provide the prophecies of his suffering and glories would you know where to go and how to expound them?

By the way did you notice in 1 Peter 1:11 both words for suffering(s) and Glory(s) are plural?

You speak as a fool Steve because you think you know the Good News of the Gospel but actually you know little, if nothing at all.

Can you list the various aspects of his sufferings? And how the Gospel allows us to enter those sufferings?  And do you know his Glories? And how that Glory will be received by those who know the true Gospel?

With your attitude why should you be taught anything?

Sadly if you know not the 2 Keys of the Kingdom how will you understand the Atonement of Salvation?

You have a long way to go Steve, a long way.

This is not about repenting Steve, its about a willingness to hear a saving message, which you think you already know!

Insight

Again, you say nothing.  Again, no gospel or good news.  Insight, there is nothing to respond to.  Your message is really no message at all.  Sorry, in our exchanges you have not ever offered a saving message.  Nothing at all.

This is not about repenting Steve, its about a willingness to hear a saving message, which you think you already know!

I believe your spirit has not changed.

Actually Steve I had a little chuckle while reading the last few posts when realising I am the only one in this conversation raising Scripture and not once have you referred to the Bible.

I weighed this against your continual bleating of "saying nothing

Insight, if you have something to say, say it.  Otherwise, there is nothing to respond to.  If you have a saving message, offer it.  Otherwise, you are just really saying nothing at all.  What you do here is bait people into exchanges.  It's a manipulative and less that straightforward and honest practice.  I have no desire to engage in your games and innuendo.  So, if you have a saving message, share it.  I'm not interested in anything else you might type up on this site.  Thanks for understanding.

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:40:44
Insight, if you have something to say, say it.  Otherwise, there is nothing to respond to.  If you have a saving message, offer it.  Otherwise, you are just really saying nothing at all.  What you do here is bait people into exchanges.  It's a manipulative and less that straightforward and honest practice.  I have no desire to engage in your games and innuendo.  So, if you have a saving message, share it.  I'm not interested in anything else you might type up on this site.  Thanks for understanding.

Yet another post without substance. More accusations without entering the Bible or its message. 

How about I listen and you explain the 2 Keys of the Kingdom.

Waiting...

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:44:27

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:40:44
Insight, if you have something to say, say it.  Otherwise, there is nothing to respond to.  If you have a saving message, offer it.  Otherwise, you are just really saying nothing at all.  What you do here is bait people into exchanges.  It's a manipulative and less that straightforward and honest practice.  I have no desire to engage in your games and innuendo.  So, if you have a saving message, share it.  I'm not interested in anything else you might type up on this site.  Thanks for understanding.

Yet another post without substance. More accusations without entering the Bible or its message. 

How about I listen and you explain the 2 Keys of the Kingdom.

Waiting...

Sorry.   Not biting.  You say you have a message.  I haven't heard it. 

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:49:22

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:44:27

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:40:44
Insight, if you have something to say, say it.  Otherwise, there is nothing to respond to.  If you have a saving message, offer it.  Otherwise, you are just really saying nothing at all.  What you do here is bait people into exchanges.  It's a manipulative and less that straightforward and honest practice.  I have no desire to engage in your games and innuendo.  So, if you have a saving message, share it.  I'm not interested in anything else you might type up on this site.  Thanks for understanding.

Yet another post without substance. More accusations without entering the Bible or its message. 

How about I listen and you explain the 2 Keys of the Kingdom.

Waiting...

Sorry.   Not biting.  You say you have a message.  I haven't heard it. 

You will not acknowledge 1 Peter 1:11 & Luke 26:24 in both instances you had the opportunity to engage in discussion but you choose to antagonise rather than harmonise a discussion.

I think if you go over then posts this will become very clear.

You give nothing and therefore receive nothing.

Telling it how it is with no embellishments.

So far I feel you are faceless, without form and void - I get nothing form you Steve - lots of excuses, but nothing else.   

It appears the Hope of Israel means nothing to you! So how can you undestand or recieve the Keys?

Quote from: Insight on Wed Dec 07, 2011 - 21:24:06You say: Jesus looked, talked, walked, ran, sat, cried, ate, defecated, etc. just like a man.
And then you say: not the nature

Nosight (or should we address you as "Unsightful"?)
Which would thouest preferest? ...

For 1700 years, the orthodox position has been that ...
Christians are supposed to see Jesus as the "God-man".

So, perhaps we should say that Jesus' true nature is that of God in a man's body.
Don't forget that Jesus' Father was none other than the Holy Spirit.
I.e. Jesus did not have man's sin nature.
Whatsoever else could have been the reason for the uniqueness of His Father?
(I.e. I'm open to suggestions.)

It is to be understood that the God-part of Jesus had control over the man-part of Him.
Ergo ... Jesus' true nature was that of "God".
Re: "God" ... Thouest may choosest whicheverest of the 3 Persons of the Triune Godhead you wish.

Razbeerishlee? That's Bulgarian for "Do you understand?"
Answer in English: No

That's why we're a-gonna call you either Nosight or Unsightful.

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:57:40

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:49:22

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:44:27

Quote from: segell on Mon Dec 12, 2011 - 22:40:44
Insight, if you have something to say, say it.  Otherwise, there is nothing to respond to.  If you have a saving message, offer it.  Otherwise, you are just really saying nothing at all.  What you do here is bait people into exchanges.  It's a manipulative and less that straightforward and honest practice.  I have no desire to engage in your games and innuendo.  So, if you have a saving message, share it.  I'm not interested in anything else you might type up on this site.  Thanks for understanding.

Yet another post without substance. More accusations without entering the Bible or its message.  

How about I listen and you explain the 2 Keys of the Kingdom.

Waiting...

Sorry.   Not biting.  You say you have a message.  I haven't heard it.  

You will not acknowledge 1 Peter 1:11 & Luke 26:24 in both instances you had the opportunity to engage in discussion but you choose to antagonise rather than harmonise a discussion.

I think if you go over then posts this will become very clear.

You give nothing and therefore receive nothing.

Telling it how it is with no embellishments.

So far I feel you are faceless, without form and void - I get nothing form you Steve - lots of excuses, but nothing else.  

It appears the Hope of Israel means nothing to you! So how can you undestand or recieve the Keys?

Thanks for pointing to 1 Peter 1.  It starts with another example of the trinity in the Scriptures and testifies that Jesus Christ is indeed God:

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Quote from: fish153 on Wed Dec 14, 2011 - 23:43:31

Thanks for pointing to 1 Peter 1.  It starts with another example of the trinity in the Scriptures and testifies that Jesus Christ is indeed God:

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Maybe you would like to enlighten us all as to how this speaks of the Trinity?

Insight

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 04:10:47

Quote from: fish153 on Wed Dec 14, 2011 - 23:43:31

Thanks for pointing to 1 Peter 1.  It starts with another example of the trinity in the Scriptures and testifies that Jesus Christ is indeed God:

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Maybe you would like to enlighten us all as to how this speaks of the Trinity?

Insight

Yes---the Trinity is involved totally in our salvation. THE FATHER calls us to himself, by the Finished work of THE SON on the cross (whom we bow to as Savior and Lord), through the HOLY SPIRIT who sanctifies us.

Of course, if you refuse to acknowledge the Trinity you will purposefully ignore this clear teaching---as it is found in other Scriptures as well.

1 x 1 x 1 = 1    There is one God in three persons.

Quote from: fish153 on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 14:24:31

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 04:10:47

Quote from: fish153 on Wed Dec 14, 2011 - 23:43:31

Thanks for pointing to 1 Peter 1.  It starts with another example of the trinity in the Scriptures and testifies that Jesus Christ is indeed God:

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Maybe you would like to enlighten us all as to how this speaks of the Trinity?

Insight

Yes---the Trinity is involved totally in our salvation. THE FATHER calls us to himself, by the Finished work of THE SON on the cross (whom we bow to as Savior and Lord), through the HOLY SPIRIT who sanctifies us.

Of course, if you refuse to acknowledge the Trinity you will purposefully ignore this clear teaching---as it is found in other Scriptures as well.

1 x 1 x 1 = 1    There is one God in three persons.

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Fish, your study practices need serious revision and your mathematics skills a rework.

Who is given the sole credit for the work of redemption? Whose foreknowledge is absolute? See Eph 1:4; Rom 8:29,33.

•   Are you able to show me a verse that shows us the foreknowing is the work of Jesus Christ or the Holy Spirit and Not God?

Now what medium has this work been done through? How does the Spirit – Word sanctify? Please See 1 Tim 4:5

•   What I am looking to see from you is an understanding of the Holy Spirit and its definition from the Bible, 1 Tim 4:5 will be a good place for you to start.

•   Once you have understood the Spirit-Word how does this relate to the phrase "obedient to Jesus Christ

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 16:27:44

Quote from: fish153 on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 14:24:31

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 04:10:47

Quote from: fish153 on Wed Dec 14, 2011 - 23:43:31

Thanks for pointing to 1 Peter 1.  It starts with another example of the trinity in the Scriptures and testifies that Jesus Christ is indeed God:

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Maybe you would like to enlighten us all as to how this speaks of the Trinity?

Insight

Yes---the Trinity is involved totally in our salvation. THE FATHER calls us to himself, by the Finished work of THE SON on the cross (whom we bow to as Savior and Lord), through the HOLY SPIRIT who sanctifies us.

Of course, if you refuse to acknowledge the Trinity you will purposefully ignore this clear teaching---as it is found in other Scriptures as well.

1 x 1 x 1 = 1    There is one God in three persons.

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Fish, your study practices need serious revision and your mathematics skills a rework.

Who is given the sole credit for the work of redemption? Whose foreknowledge is absolute? See Eph 1:4; Rom 8:29,33.

•   Are you able to show me a verse that shows us the foreknowing is the work of Jesus Christ or the Holy Spirit and Not God?

Now what medium has this work been done through? How does the Spirit – Word sanctify? Please See 1 Tim 4:5

•   What I am looking to see from you is an understanding of the Holy Spirit and its definition from the Bible, 1 Tim 4:5 will be a good place for you to start.

•   Once you have understood the Spirit-Word how does this relate to the phrase "obedient to Jesus Christ

Quote from: fish153 on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 18:35:16

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 16:27:44

Quote from: fish153 on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 14:24:31

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 04:10:47

Quote from: fish153 on Wed Dec 14, 2011 - 23:43:31

Thanks for pointing to 1 Peter 1.  It starts with another example of the trinity in the Scriptures and testifies that Jesus Christ is indeed God:

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Maybe you would like to enlighten us all as to how this speaks of the Trinity?

Insight

Yes---the Trinity is involved totally in our salvation. THE FATHER calls us to himself, by the Finished work of THE SON on the cross (whom we bow to as Savior and Lord), through the HOLY SPIRIT who sanctifies us.

Of course, if you refuse to acknowledge the Trinity you will purposefully ignore this clear teaching---as it is found in other Scriptures as well.

1 x 1 x 1 = 1    There is one God in three persons.

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Fish, your study practices need serious revision and your mathematics skills a rework.

Who is given the sole credit for the work of redemption? Whose foreknowledge is absolute? See Eph 1:4; Rom 8:29,33.

•   Are you able to show me a verse that shows us the foreknowing is the work of Jesus Christ or the Holy Spirit and Not God?

Now what medium has this work been done through? How does the Spirit – Word sanctify? Please See 1 Tim 4:5

•   What I am looking to see from you is an understanding of the Holy Spirit and its definition from the Bible, 1 Tim 4:5 will be a good place for you to start.

•   Once you have understood the Spirit-Word how does this relate to the phrase "obedient to Jesus Christ

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 18:39:21

Quote from: fish153 on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 18:35:16

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 16:27:44

Quote from: fish153 on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 14:24:31

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 04:10:47

Quote from: fish153 on Wed Dec 14, 2011 - 23:43:31

Thanks for pointing to 1 Peter 1.  It starts with another example of the trinity in the Scriptures and testifies that Jesus Christ is indeed God:

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Maybe you would like to enlighten us all as to how this speaks of the Trinity?

Insight

Yes---the Trinity is involved totally in our salvation. THE FATHER calls us to himself, by the Finished work of THE SON on the cross (whom we bow to as Savior and Lord), through the HOLY SPIRIT who sanctifies us.

Of course, if you refuse to acknowledge the Trinity you will purposefully ignore this clear teaching---as it is found in other Scriptures as well.

1 x 1 x 1 = 1    There is one God in three persons.

To God's elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood" (1 Peter 1:1,2)

Fish, your study practices need serious revision and your mathematics skills a rework.

Who is given the sole credit for the work of redemption? Whose foreknowledge is absolute? See Eph 1:4; Rom 8:29,33.

•   Are you able to show me a verse that shows us the foreknowing is the work of Jesus Christ or the Holy Spirit and Not God?

Now what medium has this work been done through? How does the Spirit – Word sanctify? Please See 1 Tim 4:5

•   What I am looking to see from you is an understanding of the Holy Spirit and its definition from the Bible, 1 Tim 4:5 will be a good place for you to start.

•   Once you have understood the Spirit-Word how does this relate to the phrase "obedient to Jesus Christ

Fish,

I will put to one side you personal taunts and focus on the truth.

Do you also believe that wisdom is a literal woman?

She is more precious than rubies: and all the things you can desire are not to be compared unto her.

If not, why do you assume God's power is a literal person?

If I adopted your rule of He or She applying to a literal person then who is this Woman called Wisdom?

Insight

Quote from: Insight on Mon Dec 19, 2011 - 20:04:24
Fish,

I will put to one side you personal taunts and focus on the truth.

Do you also believe that wisdom is a literal woman?

She is more precious than rubies: and all the things you can desire are not to be compared unto her.

If not, why do you assume God's power is a literal person?

If I adopted your rule of He or She applying to a literal person then who is this Woman called Wisdom?

Insight

Insight---

I am not taunting you. I am literally tired of how you choose to interpret Scripture to match your beliefs.  You are going to set aside many verses that clearly teach that the Holy Spirit is a person who speaks, warns, corrects, teaches and comforts us.  And you do this by picking out an example of wisdom being called "she".

"Canst thou draw out leviathan with an hook? or his tongue with a cord which thou lettest down?" (Job 41:1)

Yes--there are places in the Bible where things are personified.  In Proverbs 8 wisdom speaks--but as you read the entire chapter you see that wisdom is an attribute of God.

But the Holy Spirit is not an "it" that has been personified.  Jesus calls him "HE"----and as many verses (some which I posted) show He directly warned Paul--it doesn't say "God through the Spirit warned Paul"---no, it says "Having been warned by the Holy Spirit".

Once again Insight, you are making Scripture fit your theology, rather than your theology being based on submission to Scripture.

Quote from: fish153 on Tue Dec 20, 2011 - 12:29:28
Insight---

I am not taunting you. I am literally tired of how you choose to interpret Scripture to match your beliefs.  You are going to set aside many verses that clearly teach that the Holy Spirit is a person who speaks, warns, corrects, teaches and comforts us.  And you do this by picking out an example of wisdom being called "she".

No I am simply revealing to you, your method of assuming, because he is referred to as "he" when speaking of the Holy Spirit does not automatically mean the Holy Spirit is a separate divine being of the Godhead.  

Here is another...

Rom 6:23 The wages of sin is death

Now sin is not a person who works a 40 hour week and earns wages.

So its not enough for you to imply the masculine of femine preface as to mean a literal person.

Quote

"Canst thou draw out leviathan with an hook? or his tongue with a cord which thou lettest down?" (Job 41:1)

Yes--there are places in the Bible where things are personified.  In Proverbs 8 wisdom speaks--but as you read the entire chapter you see that wisdom is an attribute of God.

Ah...Correct

Quote

But the Holy Spirit is not an "it" that has been personified.  

Lets see why not?

Quote

Jesus calls him "HE"----and as many verses (some which I posted) show He directly warned Paul--it doesn't say "God through the Spirit warned Paul"---no, it says "Having been warned by the Holy Spirit".

What you are doing in inferring an external set of beliefs on the preface "He

Grammatically, the Holy Spirit is an "IT" in Greek.

Even in verses such as John 14:17...

Jhn 14:16   And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 
Jhn 14:17   [Even] the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. 

...the word in Greek is auto, which is in neuter case - IT.  The translator has rendered it he because of his presupposed belief in the personhood of the Holy Spirit.

Jarrod

Quote from: Wycliffes_Shillelagh on Tue Dec 20, 2011 - 23:20:14
Grammatically, the Holy Spirit is an "IT" in Greek.

Even in verses such as John 14:17...

Jhn 14:16   And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 
Jhn 14:17   [Even] the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. 

...the word in Greek is auto, which is in neuter case - IT.  The translator has rendered it he because of his presupposed belief in the personhood of the Holy Spirit.

Jarrod

Yes you are correct...but will this truth empower Christians to question the Trinity?

We shall see.