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I read this article and thought it might start some talk about something that apparently gets ignored.

To my single brothers and sisters out there: you do have my thoughts and prayers. 

An excerpt from the middle of the article:

QuoteMy research turned up a few rough figures. In their 1991 book, Single Adult Passages: Uncharted Territories, Carolyn Koons and Michael Anthony had surveyed 1,500 single Christians. They found significant levels of sexual activity.

Of the women surveyed, 39 percent were virgins. I also got hold of two similar surveys, one a singles survey from Peachtree Presbyterian Church in Atlanta and the other a survey of single Southern Baptists. Both revealed only a third of the respondents had abstained from sex.

Do pastors anywhere get this? Randy Helm, the pastor of Hope Chapel in Glendale, Arizona, told me clergy tend to think that just because the Bible condemns extramarital sex, that settles the matter. Instead, people know what the Bible says, but they don't care. He added, "You can have all the biblical knowledge in the world and that does not cancel out the raging hormones."

Especially if you've been made to wait ten or twenty years. Christian singles I talk to considered virginity as a waiting room until God produced the right mate.

When that waiting room started to look like permanent lodging, despair set in.

Some, I discovered, were—and still are—piecing together their own philosophy on sex without much consideration of the Scriptures.

They certainly do not resort to their local Christian bookstore. Why should they? One singles book I discovered was actually titled Pure Joy: The Positive Side of Single Sexuality.

The author, a man, married when he was 30. Nice guy, but I winced at the title. Believe me: The only positive side to single sexuality is not getting AIDS. The only singles I know who consider their state to be "pure joy" are those who have been through a divorce.

I found in other books that a lot of the philosophizing was being done by married people who led singles groups: people who idealized the single state but who would not have been caught dead trying it themselves, and who don't have a clue of what it is like to have a permanently empty bed.

And it's not just the doing without sex. Have you ever noticed how singles never get touched? It's living in this bubble of no hugs, no physical contact whatsoever.

http://christianpundit.wordpress.com/2012/05/07/older-single-christians-and-sex-article-by-julia-duin/

In my experience its especially hard for single ladies in church because there are just not the numbers of guys as there are women.
This seems to get worse the older they get, and so the church has many single ladies either never married or divorced or widowed, who may well never meet a decent available Christian guy.
Not surprising that so may go and marry non believers I suppose.

My experience has been different.  The hypothesis that there are more women than men in church is probably accurate and consistent with my observations.  The many potential reasons for this are far too detailed to pursuit in this post.  Maybe I'll start a separate thread on this topic.

While I agree that it's difficult for single women, I've also found it's also hard on single men.  Assuming that there are more single women than men this should present a "target rich environment" for the guys.  My experience has shown that a large percentage of the older single women tend to fall on the high maintenance end of the continuum.  The term high maintenance can range from single moms, poor financial profile, mental and or emotional disabilities, and those looking for a paycheck and a health insurance plan.
If you'll permit me to expound; some men really aren't interested in getting together with a single mom.  There may or may not be additional factors such as her kids having behavior problems or reluctance to deal with the ex-husband.  Some single moms are looking for a means of support, both financial and emotional, for herself and her, not his, kids.  I've known several single moms who stated that they were looking for a guy so they could quit working and allow the new husband to support her and her kids.  Some men aren't interested in supporting kids that aren't theirs.  While this might sound rather biased against single moms please keep in mind I was a single dad.  Before my kids grew up and moved out there were very few women who were interested in a relationship with this single dad.  Ironically some of those same women are now divorced parents and have since attempted to reconnect.

By middle age some women have made some very poor financial decisions and are now burdened with significant debt.  There are few older men, with a sound financial standing, who desire to swim in a thick pool of debt that they didn't create.  Men can make some poor financial choices as well.  Which begs the question how many women want to affiliate with a man with a poor financial discipline?
There is the collection of women who have serious emotional and/or mental health concerns.  Sometimes churches, being a place of comfort, support, and healing, attract those struggling with the aforementioned challenges.  While it's understood there is a need to minister to these precious souls, this ministry need doesn't translate into these individuals as good relationship candidates.  I will concede that there are men with mental/emotional challenges as well.  My many years in ministry to singles have shown that these men don't seek out the church for help.

Assuming the male/female imbalance is present and only a percentage of that male population is healthy and well-adjusted means the pool of suitable male candidates is even more limited.  This may provide some explanation as to why older single women have difficulty establishing relationships with Christian men and the small reservoir of men find it difficult to wade through the much larger collection of women to find a suitable relationship.

Keep in mind there is a group of men who have decided to avoid marriage all together so no amount of cajoling will draw them down the aisle to matrimony.  As a side note I've come across many married men who were jealous of my unmarried status even going so far as to say that if given the opportunity to marry again they wouldn't.

Unfortunately I don't have an explanation for why singles have a hard time maintaining celibacy.

I actually disagree with the word choice of "celibate" as used in that article.  Celibacy is a life-long commitment to the single life (like a catholic monk or priest). 

The author should have used the word "abstinent."

texas, I cant agree with you on single women. I know so many lovely godly single ladies who would love to get married. I also know some lovely ladies who are single mums through no fault of their own, who have married men who took on their children and have been excellent fathers to them.
MY own husband and I married in our late 40's, and he has been an excellent step dad to my three adult children. It didnt bother either of us that we had both got children already, or that we had both been married before. We have an excellent marriage. 

In my experience on Christian forums, at the age I was then(mid to late 40s), there were about 4 women to every man. Bearing in mind that men seem generally to want younger women,(for whatever reason) that makes the numbers ever more skewed in the mans favour. Single men coming there had loads of interest, single women of that age had very little if any.  Most churches like ours have quite a few single/divorced/widowed ladies but few or no single men. I suppose that's why some women do end up marrying non believers, because its that or nothing.

That's sad that some men are jealous of you being single. I think they forget the negative aspect of singleness and take for granted the positive aspect of marriage. I was a single mum of three teenagers/young adults for 6 years, and I would take a good marriage every time.

I am not one of the men that Tex writes about.  I never wanted to get married but am very thankful God had other ideas.....

And should I (god forbid) find myself single again; on my own I probably would not want to re-marry.  But this life in the Lord is NOT about me and what I want. (too many of us forget that fact) 

This weekend Dan Juster spoke at our congregation and his message was about fulfilling your destiny. 

Last year he gave us a definition of 'love:'  "The compassionate identification with the other, that seeks their good, guided by Law."  He changed it somewhat - dropped the com- from compassionate and saying that "seeks their good" has to be seen as helping them to fulfill their destiny.

He went on to talk about things that hinder fulfilling destiny and what helps in fulfilling destiny.

Slavery hinders destiny. 
Oppression and violence hinder destiny.
Being single when God has called you to be married hinders destiny.
Being rich and hording that wealth is hindering the destiny of many potential employees

(back to my words)
So these older single men that don't want to get married are basically being selfish, and if I ever (God forbid) found myself there, remaining single would be a selfish choice and depriving me of the opportunity of helping some single lady of fulfilling her destiny.

Quote from: DaveW on Mon Jan 13, 2014 - 08:34:47
I am not one of the men that Tex writes about.  I never wanted to get married but am very thankful God had other ideas.....

And should I (god forbid) find myself single again; on my own I probably would not want to re-marry.  But this life in the Lord is NOT about me and what I want. (too many of us forget that fact) 

This weekend Dan Juster spoke at our congregation and his message was about fulfilling your destiny. 

Last year he gave us a definition of 'love:'  "The compassionate identification with the other, that seeks their good, guided by Law."  He changed it somewhat - dropped the com- from compassionate and saying that "seeks their good" has to be seen as helping them to fulfill their destiny.

He went on to talk about things that hinder fulfilling destiny and what helps in fulfilling destiny.

Slavery hinders destiny. 
Oppression and violence hinder destiny.
Being single when God has called you to be married hinders destiny.
Being rich and hording that wealth is hindering the destiny of many potential employees

(back to my words)
So these older single men that don't want to get married are basically being selfish, and if I ever (God forbid) found myself there, remaining single would be a selfish choice and depriving me of the opportunity of helping some single lady of fulfilling her destiny.

Well that's possible Dave, but I can understand people not wanting to marry again if the love of their life had died before them. I would feel the same. Also I do know some single ladies who God has used in amazing ways despite the fact they never married.

Again, it is not about me (our you) or what we may want or not want.  It is what brings God glory - that is a part of EVERYONE's destiny.

Quote from: DaveW on Mon Jan 13, 2014 - 08:46:52
Again, it is not about me (our you) or what we may want or not want.  It is what brings God glory - that is a part of EVERYONE's destiny.

I believe that God knows us so well, that He will know if it will be good for us to marry again or not. There would be no point in His pressuring someone to marry again if they cant face that, and we don't need another partner to fulfil our destiny surely.

He gives us the desires of our hearts. When my first marriage ended after 23 years, my desire was to eventually to marry again. This time it wouldn't be to marry again. Not saying that it would never happen, but highly unlikely. There is plenty that we can all do for him if we are alone.

In reading that article my heart really goes out to the singles they describe.  While you may be just fine if you find yourself single again, not everyone will be. (or are now)

I can comprehend the ongoing slow wearing down of the sex drive year after year, decade after decade; even if it is not so intense as to drive you crazy. (and there are many being driven crazy by it, both men and women)

Then there is the loneliness. The desire to love and be loved by someone. That can drive some batty.

And it is NOT a matter of "self control." Neither Paul or Jesus ever say that.  Indeed both give support to the single life but agree that it is ONLY for those to whom it is given (a gift from God) and Paul uses "charisma" for gift.  IOW, it is in the same category as gifts of prophecy or miracles.  You cannot just choose it or conjure it up.

And then there are the single moms.  They often need a man around to help raise the family. And any man who refuses to raise a child that is not his own DNA is missing the whole "adoption as sons" that Our Lord did with us.  He first loved us.  Then we are to love others as He loves us. Freely we have received, freely give.

Quote from: texas101 on Sun Jan 12, 2014 - 21:25:30

Unfortunately I don't have an explanation for why singles have a hard time maintaining celibacy.

Texas101 I have only a few comments to your post on here before getting to the one sentence of yours that I quoted.

Your post is so insulting to women in general that I can readily understand why
you are single.

Not everyone who grew up after the insurgence of Gloria Steinem touts what she endeavored to teach. We are not all women libbers or femi-nazis.

Not all of us wanted to be knocked off our pedestals and onto our backs.

You indicate that women make poor decisions regarding their money and end up in tremendous debt that most men would not want to get tangled up with.

For your information, most women today still get paid  less then there male counterparts and for those who are equal in pay they do have a higher cost of expenses in expected personal appearance and if they have children, in child care.

You say that men dont want to get entangled with women with children because they do not want to support those kids or the involvement she may have with her ex? What about his involvement with his ex that she would need to put up with.

I am not going to comment on your entire post because your
general lumping of most all women into the same category that you have done is not only a dis-service to them but to the concept of marriage ... period.

Blending a family is never easy. But no matter how you look at things males and females have , or should have, respective roles.... and they are not the same.

MEN AND WOMEN ARE NOT EQUAL. EACH HAS A SEPARATE ROLE THAT WHEN JOINED TOGETHER MAKES A WHOLE.

If you read God's word you know that God truly never intended for people to end up in the mess that "we" have created for ourselves with the universal acceptance of no-fault divorce.

I had a friend who married for the first time in  her early 40s and his kids did not live with him.

Before she was getting married she was avidly looking for work that would pay her more. Now mind you.. she owned her own house with her sister and he was going to move into her house.

When asked why she was looking for better paying work as she was soon going to be getting married and surly her current job was enough she looked shocked and  simply said, "I have to keep myself."  You see, her sister, who shared the house, would be moving out, and new hubby was NOT going to be making many contributions.

And even myself... who has never married.... have found that these days the old game of he chases her until she catches him no longer applies. Most dating is done dutch treat style.

My observations are that the excuses that men use for not wanting to be involved with a woman with kids, or maybe not financially secure, and God forbid, she may have a parent to tend to, in fact are............ men want to be MR MOM.

They no longer want to follow what my beliefs have always been in that the ART OF BEING A WOMAN IS TO BRING OUT THE BEST IN A MAN....

BECAUSE......

Most men today just do not want to be the man of the house or the bread winner.

I'll stop now and finish with a comment about the quote from your post.

"Unfortunately I don't have an explanation for why singles have a hard time maintaining celibacy."

I have no idea what your age is but if you, as a man, who has indicated you are
single... and you have grown children, which means you were married and are divorced or a widower, can say that you have not had trouble maintaining celibacy
or abstaining.. I would comment on this but this is not the forum for that.

But I can assure you that we, who have never married, struggle with this both male and female.... coupled with loneliness, and the lack of the love shared by the binding of a male/female as one is not at all fun. I personally do not call this a gift.

Quote from: DaveW on Mon Jan 13, 2014 - 11:33:52
In reading that article my heart really goes out to the singles they describe.  While you may be just fine if you find yourself single again, not everyone will be. (or are now)

I can comprehend the ongoing slow wearing down of the sex drive year after year, decade after decade; even if it is not so intense as to drive you crazy. (and there are many being driven crazy by it, both men and women)

Then there is the loneliness. The desire to love and be loved by someone. That can drive some batty.

And it is NOT a matter of "self control." Neither Paul or Jesus ever say that.  Indeed both give support to the single life but agree that it is ONLY for those to whom it is given (a gift from God) and Paul uses "charisma" for gift.  IOW, it is in the same category as gifts of prophecy or miracles.  You cannot just choose it or conjure it up.

And then there are the single moms.  They often need a man around to help raise the family. And any man who refuses to raise a child that is not his own DNA is missing the whole "adoption as sons" that Our Lord did with us.  He first loved us.  Then we are to love others as He loves us. Freely we have received, freely give.

yes and I was single mum for 6 years, and my husband did take my children as his own when we married. However millions of single parents do really well on their own, (as I hope I did for 6 years) and do a brilliant job. Women these days aren't helpless to earn their own money and run a home.
  In my experience, if God wants us to do something, He gives us a desire to do so. He has done this with me several times in my life.

If someone doesn't ever want to marry again after loosing the love of their life then why would they need to? God would understand that special relationship they had, and respect that.

I actually know four men who met new partners merely weeks or a few months after their wives died, and married merely a year later, and I just don't get that at all. How can they possibly have had time to grieve and recover? It took me 3-4 years after my divorce before I could even consider another man, but this time, if my husband dies before me, I wouldnt consider another man. No one could match up to him.

I find it interesting that women often complain that men won't share their feeling and opinions.  When a man does express his feelings and opinions he gets blasted by the ladies.  And the ladies can't figure out why men are reluctant to get married.

Marriage is not a cure for loneliness.  Being single does not equate to selfish, a spouse can be selfish.  Being single gives me more freedom to serve both the community and my church.  The Apostle Paul even said it was better to be unmarried.


Response to Chosenone

I've heard for a long time about the lack of single men in church.  Has anyone asked the question as to why single men aren't found in church?  It seems that the female/male ratio would motivate Christian men to look within the church for a spouse.

Like you, I married someone with kids.  After the divorce (biblical grounds) the courts gave me custody of my three step kids who I raised as a single parent.

Let's not forget that marriage has its negative aspects as well.  I've seen both sides of the equation.  There are worse things that being single.

I agree that single men tend to look for younger women.  It also means that younger women are aimed at older men.  Again is anyone asking why this is the case?  I'm concerned if I were to express my opinions as to why this is the case I'd be tarred and feathered by the ladies.


Response to Rella

Men and women both make poor financial decisions.  I'm not referring to lack of income or situations that demands higher expenses to maintain a household.  I'm referring to irresponsible financial management by both sexes.  Women should avoid men who've demonstrated poor financial discipline.  If I muddied the waters on this point I apologize.

I'm well aware that on average women in many industries are compensated less than men.  I firmly believe in equal pay for equal work and it's not fair when this doesn't happen.  I've been an industry mentor to several young ladies pursuing an education in engineering.  One of my students is completing her Masters in Biomedical Engineering.  As an engineer I'm doing what can be done within my abilities to change this situation.

I do understand the increased living costs as a single parent.  I was a single parent with no financial support from my kid's mother.  What's also not fair are the courts refusing to enforce child support orders on women.

Rella you've said, "You say that men don't want to get entangled with women with children because they do not want to support those kids or the involvement she may have with her ex? What about his involvement with his ex that she would need to put up with."

The reason given to me by several women as to why they weren't interested in a relationship with a single dad is they didn't want to get involved with my kids or have to deal with my ex.

Quote from: DaveW on Fri Jan 10, 2014 - 13:45:31

QuoteThe author, a man, married when he was 30. Nice guy, but I winced at the title. Believe me: The only positive side to single sexuality is not getting AIDS. The only singles I know who consider their state to be "pure joy" are those who have been through a divorce.

I found in other books that a lot of the philosophizing was being done by married people who led singles groups: people who idealized the single state but who would not have been caught dead trying it themselves, and who don't have a clue of what it is like to have a permanently empty bed.

And it's not just the doing without sex. Have you ever noticed how singles never get touched? It's living in this bubble of no hugs, no physical contact whatsoever.

http://christianpundit.wordpress.com/2012/05/07/older-single-christians-and-sex-article-by-julia-duin/

People who are single certainly can have joy, if their heart is in the right place.  Keeping in mind that "joy" doesn't mean "happy feelings".  An excerpt from an article from a recent article about a book which looked at the article, data collected via survey:

http://www.zenit.org/en/articles/study-most-priests-are-happy-appreciate-celibacy

QuoteStudy: Most Priests Are Happy, Appreciate Celibacy
Interview With Monsignor Stephen Rossetti

October 05, 2011 | 12003 hits

By Genevieve Pollock

WASHINGTON, D.C., OCT. 5, 2011 (Zenit.org).- Priests in general are among the happiest members of society, says Monsignor Stephen Rossetti, and contrary to secular opinion, most embrace celibacy as a positive aspect of their vocation.

These were some of the conclusions outlined by Monsignor Rossetti in his book, "Why Priests Are Happy" (Ave Maria Press), which will be released Wednesday.

The author, who is currently serving as associate dean for seminary and ministerial programs at The Catholic University of America, also wrote "Born of the Eucharist," "The Joy of Priesthood," and "When the Lion Roars." As a licensed psychologist, Monsignor Rossetti previously worked as president and CEO of Saint Luke's Institute, a treatment and education center for clergy and religious.

The author surveyed 2,500 priests, and made discoveries that modern society might find surprising.

When a person finds their particular vocation from God, then celibacy can be a very joyful experience.  I think that our culture finds the celibate vocation of priesthood or consecrated life (nuns) anathema to it's idea of "the good life".  But it is easy to find so many priests and nuns who, though pledged to celibacy, are precisely radiant with joy.

It is not the celibacy that brings people down and makes them miserable, but bitterness from the mistaken idea that there is only one kind of union, and the fact that they don't have it.  Everyone longs for unity, and marriage is a sign and symbol of unity which we will have with God in heaven.  But it is not the only sign and symbol.  The consecrated life and the celibate priesthood are too a sign of that union we will have with God in heaven, in which people are not married nor given in marriage.  And it is one that can be lived here and now, one which is praised by Paul AND Jesus; a very high calling.

God has a plan for each person, a vocation for them.  It involves some kind of union.  To think that marriage is the only form can lead people into misery.   I think anyone who is single should not assume that their vocation is married life, but rather discern which form of union God wants for them, either consecrated life or marriage.  Because finding the vocation God has for us is a great source of joy.

Catholica, I do agree that some people have that charismatic supernatural gift from God to be lifelong celibates.

A good friend of one of my sons-in-law was ordained a priest a little over a year ago at Catholic U in DC and took a parish somewhere in Ohio.  Brother Ezra (now Fr. Ezra?) and I had several conversations on this and he described the process in place currently to weed out those who do not have that gift and to weed out men with other problems as well that may lead to gay or pedophile priests. (don't need any more of them) It seemed pretty good.   

That said; probably 90% of us do NOT have that gift.  We would NOT be happy in that vocation. I know I would not.

And as the article said, there are a lot of people out there who are aching for a godly spouse and no one seems to be showing up.  My heart really goes out to them. Often they get tired of waiting and end up breaking the rules.

Quote from: texas101 on Thu Jan 16, 2014 - 10:29:31
I find it interesting that women often complain that men won't share their feeling and opinions.  When a man does express his feelings and opinions he gets blasted by the ladies.  And the ladies can't figure out why men are reluctant to get married.

Marriage is not a cure for loneliness.  Being single does not equate to selfish, a spouse can be selfish.  Being single gives me more freedom to serve both the community and my church.  The Apostle Paul even said it was better to be unmarried.


Response to Chosenone

I've heard for a long time about the lack of single men in church.  Has anyone asked the question as to why single men aren't found in church?  It seems that the female/male ratio would motivate Christian men to look within the church for a spouse.

Like you, I married someone with kids.  After the divorce (biblical grounds) the courts gave me custody of my three step kids who I raised as a single parent.

Let's not forget that marriage has its negative aspects as well.  I've seen both sides of the equation.  There are worse things that being single.

I agree that single men tend to look for younger women.  It also means that younger women are aimed at older men.  Again is anyone asking why this is the case?  I'm concerned if I were to express my opinions as to why this is the case I'd be tarred and feathered by the ladies.


Response to Rella

Men and women both make poor financial decisions.  I'm not referring to lack of income or situations that demands higher expenses to maintain a household.  I'm referring to irresponsible financial management by both sexes.  Women should avoid men who've demonstrated poor financial discipline.  If I muddied the waters on this point I apologize.

I'm well aware that on average women in many industries are compensated less than men.  I firmly believe in equal pay for equal work and it's not fair when this doesn't happen.  I've been an industry mentor to several young ladies pursuing an education in engineering.  One of my students is completing her Masters in Biomedical Engineering.  As an engineer I'm doing what can be done within my abilities to change this situation.

I do understand the increased living costs as a single parent.  I was a single parent with no financial support from my kid's mother.  What's also not fair are the courts refusing to enforce child support orders on women.

Rella you've said, "You say that men don't want to get entangled with women with children because they do not want to support those kids or the involvement she may have with her ex? What about his involvement with his ex that she would need to put up with."

The reason given to me by several women as to why they weren't interested in a relationship with a single dad is they didn't want to get involved with my kids or have to deal with my ex.

Are men reluctant to get married? I hardly know any Christian guys who aren't married.   Most single Christian men are already in church, and those who aren't Christian arent going to want Christian wives are they. 

No younger women are usually not aimed at older men. When my older daughter was on an on line Christian dating site (then in her late 20's)she used to get messages from men in their 40's, and she was NOT interested.

I think a lot of older men deceive themselves thinking that they can catch a much younger lady, but that's not often the case(unless they are rich or famous or powerful). Most marriages that I know have spouses of more or less the same age, or at least only a few years apart.
I think some men generally think that having a younger lady will make them look more 'virile' and 'cool'. Also because they struggle to accept that they are getting older, and also because they want to prove that they have still 'got it', whatever 'it' is.

When I was on on line dating sites for 2 years on and off, there were men there in their late 40's and 50s who wanted women in their 30's who hadn't been married and who didn't have children and who wanted children. Guess what, they were all still there 2 years later when some of the lovely ladies of around their own age had found nice godly husbands, and they are probably still searching now. Most women don't want much older men in my experience, and why should they. My hubby is slightly younger that me actually. lol.

Quote from: DaveW on Thu Jan 16, 2014 - 12:15:11
Catholica, I do agree that some people have that charismatic supernatural gift from God to be lifelong celibates.

A good friend of one of my sons-in-law was ordained a priest a little over a year ago at Catholic U in DC and took a parish somewhere in Ohio.  Brother Ezra (now Fr. Ezra?) and I had several conversations on this and he described the process in place currently to weed out those who do not have that gift and to weed out men with other problems as well that may lead to gay or pedophile priests. (don't need any more of them) It seemed pretty good.   

That said; probably 90% of us do NOT have that gift.  We would NOT be happy in that vocation. I know I would not.

And as the article said, there are a lot of people out there who are aching for a godly spouse and no one seems to be showing up.  My heart really goes out to them. Often they get tired of waiting and end up breaking the rules.

Yes and I actually know 2 lovely young Christian ladies in their 30s, who are now considering finding a non believer just for this reason. For many of them it will be this or nothing due to the disparity in numbers, and who can honestly blame them.  Personally I wouldnt marry a non believer but I can understand those who do.

Regarding older men seeking younger men.  These are broad generalities, and as usual someone will claim an outlier as an example why my assertions are in error.  The age range I'm referring to would be a middle forties man with a middle thirties women.  There are men with unreasonable expectations when searching for a women 20+ years his junior.  For every man who marries an younger women requires a younger women to do so as well.

One of the reasons older men are seeking younger women is older men sometimes see younger women as having far less emotional baggage than older women.  Younger women (of child bearing age) are sometimes looking for an older man for different reasons.  Older men tend to be reaching the pinnacle in their career including financial stability.  Sometime younger women are looking for a more secure environment to raise a family.

Surely if one reason is less baggage, then the same reason could be given for an older women to seek a younger man? What's baggage anyway, anything can be worked though with Gods help. My husband and I who married in our late 40's, had loads of baggage, including 5 children between us, long first marriages, troublesome ex's and MIL's etc etc and we have worked it all though with Gods help and have a brilliant marriage.

I am sure there are a few younger ladies who want an older man for his money and house etc but that's pretty shallow surely? Must admit that its the
rich old guys who attract the young ladies, I wonder why?? The thing is that these guys can want all they like, but they rarely find a lady that much younger than them who is interested. Which of course isn't a surprise to us women.

I remember one man on the dating forum saying that he wanted a younger lady because women of his own age, and I quote, "wouldnt be able to keep up with him" I had to laugh at that, and his sheer arrogance and self deception.  Of course that isn't true, in fact it seems that in general men tend to age sooner that women, they pass their sexual peak much much earlier, and they die before women as well. One reason why I wasn't interested in an older men. I have lost one marriage/husband and I didnt want to loose another when I was still only in my 50's or 60's. Also I didn't want to be a carer for a very old guy when I was still full of energy and life.

Strangely enough I know more marriages where the men is several years younger that the lady, maybe they are cottoning on to this 'no baggage' lark.

Quote from: Rella on Wed Jan 15, 2014 - 14:25:12
Most men today just do not want to be the man of the house or the bread winner.

Really? I wonder how you get that impression, because from what I can tell it's mainstream culture resisting the very idea of "man of the house" and many young men today simply cannot get their foot in the door for a career. The average salary for a man today is some $32,000 a year (IF he's fortunate enough to be working at all). How does the idea of a married couple living on that income sound?

Is this news?

One huge reason why men are "putting off" marriage is because of the stigma that they need careers established first before thinking about getting married, and opportunities for young men have probably never been worse in the history of the country--the older generation simply refuses to meet the younger today, and there's nothing the youth can do about that. That is, experience is the biggest factor of hiring.

And, if young men DID have any advantage (natural or otherwise) over women for getting into careers to be the "sole breadwinner" as traditionalists consider appropriate, feminists will make an opportunity out of it to fund the millionth taxpayer-funded program dedicated to establishing (or rather, forcing) equality so as to guarantee equal results.

Traditionalists just refuse to acknowledge reality in these areas, and so of course haven't even started to propose solutions to these issues. But it's real and staring the world right in the face. The issue of fewer marriages just doesn't have to be a big mystery if you acknowledge these facts.

Christian mail order bride company from Russia

Western women (americans & brits) are too much of a pain

Quote from: Texas Conservative on Sat Jan 25, 2014 - 15:08:02
Western women (americans & brits) are too much of a pain

Sometimes I wonder why western women even want to marry men, when the way they usually talk sounds so much like they consider themselves so far above men in worth and holiness.

Ya . . . I've had the same thoughts . . . like I should heed the advice of a lot of men who say to get out of the country before getting married.

Quote from: texas101 on Thu Jan 16, 2014 - 10:29:31

I've heard for a long time about the lack of single men in church.  Has anyone asked the question as to why single men aren't found in church?  It seems that the female/male ratio would motivate Christian men to look within the church for a spouse.

Ok, I may get shot down for saying this...but actually, you're right!  If churches are full of eligible unattached women, then how come the men aren't flocking to the doors?  And ok (gulps), this is where I may get shot down....a good chunk of those women are (in my opinion) not elligible.  Although it sounds vacuous and empty, it IS important to look after yourself and not just fall down into the frumps.  There's quite a lot of gals my age, who have done that.   I'm not saying that looks are everything (of course, they're not) but looks are what initially attracts attention...and if the gals are sitting there, looking like they just fell out of bed, it's not exactly an attractive prospect.

We have to make the best of what God has given us...and we also have to develop interests beyond just husband-hunting.  The most attractive women ever, are those who are confident (not arrogant) in who they are, at peace with their lot in life, and seeking to make the best of what they have been blessed with.   I'm not sure that many of us are really like that?   Personally...I try to always make an effort when I go out.  I just think it's important.

(please don't anyone shoot me down!)

Quote from: Faithful on Sat Feb 08, 2014 - 05:39:40

Quote from: texas101 on Thu Jan 16, 2014 - 10:29:31

I've heard for a long time about the lack of single men in church.  Has anyone asked the question as to why single men aren't found in church?  It seems that the female/male ratio would motivate Christian men to look within the church for a spouse.

Ok, I may get shot down for saying this...but actually, you're right!  If churches are full of eligible unattached women, then how come the men aren't flocking to the doors?  And ok (gulps), this is where I may get shot down....a good chunk of those women are (in my opinion) not elligible.  Although it sounds vacuous and empty, it IS important to look after yourself and not just fall down into the frumps.  There's quite a lot of gals my age, who have done that.   I'm not saying that looks are everything (of course, they're not) but looks are what initially attracts attention...and if the gals are sitting there, looking like they just fell out of bed, it's not exactly an attractive prospect.

We have to make the best of what God has given us...and we also have to develop interests beyond just husband-hunting.  The most attractive women ever, are those who are confident (not arrogant) in who they are, at peace with their lot in life, and seeking to make the best of what they have been blessed with.   I'm not sure that many of us are really like that?   Personally...I try to always make an effort when I go out.  I just think it's important.

(please don't anyone shoot me down!)

Christian culture always seemed to me like the absolute worst place to find a wife--note that I don't mean genuine Christian women. But this is kind of the reason in itself, that it's just sort of assumed that it's the man who has proving to do, as it's men who owe the world something and might not measure up (only a few good men out there, right?), but a woman is entitled to being automatically appreciated. Men in church culture are responsible for that atmosphere too (seems to me).

That said, though, I have seen a good number of examples of married and single Christian women who are aspiring to be set apart in their manner from the modern culture and turning to their Bibles as a model for themselves--so that's admirable.

Quote
Christian culture always seemed to me like the absolute worst place to find a wife--note that I don't mean genuine Christian women. But this is kind of the reason in itself, that it's just sort of assumed that it's the man who has proving to do, as it's men who owe the world something and might not measure up (only a few good men out there, right?), but a woman is entitled to being automatically appreciated. Men in church culture are responsible for that atmosphere too (seems to me).

I'm not sure how to respond to this, but I do agree with some things you say. Very early on I have had a lot of faith in God about finding the right wife for me, that is why I have been abstinent. I've done much study, developed my self control and am just shaping myself in preparation in almost every way possible.

Its kind of insulting that some women are relying on the forgiving cliches of Christianity to not make an effort to make themselves appealing. I understand that the faith accepts you for who you are, but a lack of effort to be the most you can be is just that. I think it's kind of selfish to expect for yourself a great mate when you can't even fulfill the standards you put on your mate.

Quote from: Cally on Sat Feb 08, 2014 - 09:38:48

Quote from: Faithful on Sat Feb 08, 2014 - 05:39:40

Quote from: texas101 on Thu Jan 16, 2014 - 10:29:31

I've heard for a long time about the lack of single men in church.  Has anyone asked the question as to why single men aren't found in church?  It seems that the female/male ratio would motivate Christian men to look within the church for a spouse.

Ok, I may get shot down for saying this...but actually, you're right!  If churches are full of eligible unattached women, then how come the men aren't flocking to the doors?  And ok (gulps), this is where I may get shot down....a good chunk of those women are (in my opinion) not elligible.  Although it sounds vacuous and empty, it IS important to look after yourself and not just fall down into the frumps.  There's quite a lot of gals my age, who have done that.   I'm not saying that looks are everything (of course, they're not) but looks are what initially attracts attention...and if the gals are sitting there, looking like they just fell out of bed, it's not exactly an attractive prospect.

We have to make the best of what God has given us...and we also have to develop interests beyond just husband-hunting.  The most attractive women ever, are those who are confident (not arrogant) in who they are, at peace with their lot in life, and seeking to make the best of what they have been blessed with.   I'm not sure that many of us are really like that?   Personally...I try to always make an effort when I go out.  I just think it's important.

(please don't anyone shoot me down!)

Christian culture always seemed to me like the absolute worst place to find a wife--note that I don't mean genuine Christian women. But this is kind of the reason in itself, that it's just sort of assumed that it's the man who has proving to do, as it's men who owe the world something and might not measure up (only a few good men out there, right?), but a woman is entitled to being automatically appreciated. Men in church culture are responsible for that atmosphere too (seems to me).

That said, though, I have seen a good number of examples of married and single Christian women who are aspiring to be set apart in their manner from the modern culture and turning to their Bibles as a model for themselves--so that's admirable.

Christian women have a far far harder time of finding a decent Christians spouse than men do. There are far more women in the church than men, and this gets worse as you get older. I know countless lovely godly single Christian women in the church in their 20's and upwards, but only a tiny number of men. Most Christian men get snapped up before their late 20's and even the ones who are divorced or widowed, are usually quickly married again. I know 3 Christian men who were married again only a year after their wives died.   If a woman's husband dies, she can more or less say goodbye to any further relationships, especially if she is older than her 40's or 50's.