Christian Forums

Quote from: Johnb on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 11:44:52
Circuitridingpreacher
I don't believe dave is saying these folks won't be saved. (David correct me if I am misunderstanding you)  The blook of Christ goes both backward and forward.  They were justified by faith as we are but not faith in Christ.  Therefore not what one would call a Christian.  (That being one who comes to God by faith in Christ. Later Johnb     

Just like Christians should be expecting Christ to return a second time, David, Abraham and the rest listed were expecting Christ to come the first time to pay their sin debt. They all earnestly trusted in Christ's atonement for salvation. Now Ahab on the other hand though belonging to Israel by birth, does not belong to the bride and is hellbound.


CRP

Quote from: VerbumReale on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 08:20:33
Richard,
We're all aware of the checkered past od organized religion. Nobody is trying to justify or overlook any of that. And it is well documented on these forums how you feel about organized religion.

So, that in mind, I am curious, what is your alternative? Maybe that's a topic for another thread, I don't know. And I am not trying to avoid the topic or come across as critical of you.

But when I read your post that is my first thought. While I don't join you in what seems to be a universal condemnation of organized religion, I concede that there are humungous problems with organized religion. I will concede that organized religion has a lot of problems. I think there is much good from organized religion that you overlook, but there is also a lot of problems.

And since there are people out there like you and Robert who have been so vastly turned off by organized religion that they dare not darken the door of a church building, then I am curious what should the alternative be? We are told to fellowship together.

I have been to home worship services where all they wanted to do was sit around and criticise denominations and large churches. Please tell me you have some alternative other than that in mind.  

It is not that I don't dare darken the door of a Church. What I do is join in with a Sunday school class, a Sunday night Bible study class, and a Tuesday night Bible study class. But that does not mean that I am supporting a Church. As a matter of fact, the Tuesday night Bible study class meets in the homes of the people in the class. I do not go to the Church service since there is never any actual study of the Scriptures. It is usually a sermon using a snipet of Scripture pulled out of context to make up a nice story about social living or to support a doctine of works.

You said; "I am curious what should the alternative be? We are told to fellowship together."

I think I am fellowshipping together with like minded Christians. Why do you think that their can only be fellowship in an organized Church? I have never found that there is much fellowswhip in the Church services of an organized religion. The only real fellowship is in small groups studing the word of God. It is in these groups that there is real fellowship.

Quote from: RichardBurger on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 18:37:57

Quote from: VerbumReale on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 08:20:33
Richard,
We're all aware of the checkered past od organized religion. Nobody is trying to justify or overlook any of that. And it is well documented on these forums how you feel about organized religion.

So, that in mind, I am curious, what is your alternative? Maybe that's a topic for another thread, I don't know. And I am not trying to avoid the topic or come across as critical of you.

But when I read your post that is my first thought. While I don't join you in what seems to be a universal condemnation of organized religion, I concede that there are humungous problems with organized religion. I will concede that organized religion has a lot of problems. I think there is much good from organized religion that you overlook, but there is also a lot of problems.

And since there are people out there like you and Robert who have been so vastly turned off by organized religion that they dare not darken the door of a church building, then I am curious what should the alternative be? We are told to fellowship together.

I have been to home worship services where all they wanted to do was sit around and criticise denominations and large churches. Please tell me you have some alternative other than that in mind.  

It is not that I don't dare darken the door of a Church. What I do is join in with a Sunday school class, a Sunday night Bible study class, and a Tuesday night Bible study class. But that does not mean that I am supporting a Church. As a matter of fact, the Tuesday night Bible study class meets in the homes of the people in the class. I do not go to the Church service since there is never any actual study of the Scriptures. It is usually a sermon using a snipet of Scripture pulled out of context to make up a nice story about social living or to support a doctine of works.

You said; "I am curious what should the alternative be? We are told to fellowship together."

I think I am fellowshipping together with like minded Christians. Why do you think that their can only be fellowship in an organized Church? I have never found that there is much fellowswhip in the Church services of an organized religion. The only real fellowship is in small groups studing the word of God. It is in these groups that there is real fellowship.

Another day another time I might have responded to this but after the post you put up in another thread where you made a completely unsubstantaisted accusation against me, essentially accusing me of conspiring against you behind your back I will decline, lest I say something that might lead to another false unsubstantiated accustion. I do not come to these boards to be treated like that.

Quote from: Circuitridingpreacher on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 17:55:16

Quote from: david johnson on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 17:21:23

Quote from: Johnb on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 11:44:52
Circuitridingpreacher
I don't believe dave is saying these folks won't be saved. (David correct me if I am misunderstanding you)  The blook of Christ goes both backward and forward.  They were justified by faith as we are but not faith in Christ.  Therefore not what one would call a Christian.  (That being one who comes to God by faith in Christ. Later Johnb     

they're smart enough to figure that out.  these guys just ignore it, 'cause it does not fit their scheme.

dj

I don't really have much of a scheme, but wouldn't mind finding out what yours is.

Do you believe David and Abraham belong to the bride of Christ?

If your answer is yes, then they are indeed Christians, if no, then please explain the tier system you have created in heaven?

CRP

i've created a tier system in heaven?  a fine extrapolation of silliness you have there.
the atonement of Christ for those that preceded His earthly death makes them saved.
i will be glad to read the passage in genesis that cites abraham's baptism in the tigris or euphrates, though.

dj

Quote from: david johnson on Mon Dec 17, 2007 - 03:41:35

Quote from: Circuitridingpreacher on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 17:55:16

Quote from: david johnson on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 17:21:23

Quote from: Johnb on Sun Dec 16, 2007 - 11:44:52
Circuitridingpreacher
I don't believe dave is saying these folks won't be saved. (David correct me if I am misunderstanding you)  The blook of Christ goes both backward and forward.  They were justified by faith as we are but not faith in Christ.  Therefore not what one would call a Christian.  (That being one who comes to God by faith in Christ. Later Johnb     

they're smart enough to figure that out.  these guys just ignore it, 'cause it does not fit their scheme.

dj

I don't really have much of a scheme, but wouldn't mind finding out what yours is.

Do you believe David and Abraham belong to the bride of Christ?

If your answer is yes, then they are indeed Christians, if no, then please explain the tier system you have created in heaven?

CRP

i've created a tier system in heaven?  a fine extrapolation of silliness you have there.
the atonement of Christ for those that preceded His earthly death makes them saved.
i will be glad to read the passage in genesis that cites abraham's baptism in the tigris or euphrates, though.

dj

Do Abraham and David belong to the bride of Christ or not?

CRP

You just don't get it, as soon as you wrote down what you believe, yaou became a religion.

FTL