Christian Forums

  I want to know the truth from my fellow Christian brothers...I'm female...having trouble with dating guys ...Christian & non Christian.....& wanna be Christians....I was engaged...broke my & Gods rules bout sex before marriage....In my heart I would have married him right away...he had phobia bout marriage....he kept sabataging relationship emotionally abusive & MYCHRITIAN PREMARITAL COUNSELOR SAID i'D BE UNHAPPY....I & my fiancee knew this was true..I gave ring back.....now I'm strong bout sex thing....I tell guys how I feel...but doesnt matter....most want it right now....get mad dont call again.....some dont get mad just dont call again....I tell them I dont believe in casual sex.  its hard for me too!....they try to make moves....then act like they have been rejected cause I remind them i believe in having a serious relationship before that would even be a problem & then one should restrain if messed up confess & try not to do it again till marryed......is it that  guys just want sex? do they not like me enough to get to know me?Please tell me how to handle this situation.......I want to put God first before my desires....but I feel like guys dont understand this....help! 

Are these all born again Christian guys who are pressuring you for sex?

There has been many times I have tried to get sex out of a young lady I'm dating in hopes I get turned down. I know how many women judge us guys as far as liking her. If I don't try I fear she won't think I am really liking her. I will like her more if she refuses. But I'm always an odd duck anyway. 

If a Christisn guy had tried to pressure me into sex, he would have been out the door quick as anything. 

  In answer to your question...is it all born again Christian guys.?....all claim to be......some I believe are....they arent actually pressuring me into it....only with their perserverance.....but I think if ya keep saying better stop....slow down...& say over & over again I dont believe in casual sex....need to get to know each other...they would stop ......when they dont ..I feel thats all they are after ...Its just happened over & over again....I am a positive person...& I feel hurt.I'm thinking am I not worth enough to just get to know.. see if there is compatibility....& I'm also thinking.....are girls just giving in now...& guys expect it....so why would they ever make a commitment if they get it for free?I do know girls who have give in...& the guy marrys her anyway...am I niave? I thought this is the way God would want it.....I want to put God first...I almost feel like I've been violated by my x-fiancee cause he just didnt want to lose me. I gave into him I luved him..but  kept draging the marriage date out longer was really sabataging relationship....But I think deep down inside he didnt want to be married...I saw him on daring site the other day ...I want to contact him & tell him hes a player a fake....even though I gave the ring back to him....I feel so wounded...I dont know if I will ever fall in luv again...how often does that happen?....why didnt he appreciate it?.....I just want to protect myself now....I havent saw anyone else on sites I felt someting just looking at their eyes...there was something bout him as soon as I saw his picture....I felt like I could see to his soul through his sensitive eyes...I'm mad at myself Im mad at him....Im just mad & dont just give my heart unless I luv someone ...so how do I get it back & move on? I wouldnt go back with him he was passive aggressive...he couldnt let me in...he hurt me emotionally to push me away...if he let God change him...Id take him back....sorry I pour my heart out on here...I have no family left except my son...he does help me....he has different views than I do on religion...but I believe he is saved....I'd appreciate prayers & any Christian advice & experiences...since no one knows who we are on this site....I'd appreciate total honesty.from guys bout this...remember ya dont have to show signature at bottom..in case someone on this site knows who ya are...luv ya my sisters & brothers in Christ! mind boggled

Despite the married women trying, but miserably failing to answer your question pointed specifically at Single Christian Men. (some feel the right to butt in to every conversation)

Look...if I were not to make any sexual advance of any kind towards a young lady that I was dating she would feel as if I didn't really like her despite any facial or body language I expressed. It happened enough times on different dates that I got the clue. (Some one finally came right out and said as much)

It isn't that I wanted my dates afterwards to agree...or that I would press hard for the physical intimacy. (it is always a rather weak attempt at best) I simply was trying to express my true feelings for her in a fashion that she would recognize. 

I am always somewhat careful about even whom I asked for a first date.  I need to know who it is that I am going out with...I need to know if she has some kind of history or reputation in the community. Guys are just as vulnerable as women when it comes to dating. Any woman who wants to tell some kind of lie about a guy can trash his reputation very easily making it impossible for him to overcome it in a community.

You, as well, should be rather discerning about whom you accept dates from. Just cause he is in attendance of church and is rather attractive to you isn't grounds enough for a first date. 

mindboggled
I have said this before, but from your posts, I do feel that you are far too wrapped up with your previous guy to be ready to date again. You need to give yourself time to heal and forgive and get over him before you start thinking about another relationship. Its still very soon after you went through all that with your ex fiance. Give yourself any other few months at least before you date again. Spend time with God and let him heal you.

Quote from: JohnDB on Sun Nov 14, 2010 - 16:33:57
Despite the married women trying, but miserably failing to answer your question pointed specifically at Single Christian Men. (some feel the right to butt in to every conversation)

Look...if I were not to make any sexual advance of any kind towards a young lady that I was dating she would feel as if I didn't really like her despite any facial or body language I expressed. It happened enough times on different dates that I got the clue. (Some one finally came right out and said as much)

It isn't that I wanted my dates afterwards to agree...or that I would press hard for the physical intimacy. (it is always a rather weak attempt at best) I simply was trying to express my true feelings for her in a fashion that she would recognize.  

I am always somewhat careful about even whom I asked for a first date.  I need to know who it is that I am going out with...I need to know if she has some kind of history or reputation in the community. Guys are just as vulnerable as women when it comes to dating. Any woman who wants to tell some kind of lie about a guy can trash his reputation very easily making it impossible for him to overcome it in a community.

You, as well, should be rather discerning about whom you accept dates from. Just cause he is in attendance of church and is rather attractive to you isn't grounds enough for a first date.  

Strange why you are always so rude. I have never encountered anyone else who is as rude as you, or anyhwere near it, quite incredible.

  Oh I forgot, I've never been single have I, and never dated any guys either. No thats right.

 ::saint::I appreciate youre honesty....I will be honest that it is a compliment to be acknowledged affectionately.....but to a degree. if she is sincere bout putting God first that is..cant speak for all girls.......a passionate kiss hand holding alluring look in the eyes.....is enough to show a girl you are attracted to her....its hard for me to not do physically what I want also.....but I just limit myself on getting to caught up in the passion ......by stopping taking a break in between kissing....cause guys get to the Rushing finger...wandering hands thing fast.......I dont mind guys showing me their attraction towards me ....if they respect my wishes & not continue to pursue their quest(is that the right phrase here?)...so if thats why some of the guys show affection to not insult the girl....then why dont they then say okay I understand Im just so attracted to you.....& there ya go....shes complimented for the night & dont feel like shes been in a wrestling match all night(lol)...I guess this is the part where I feel I'm getting any respect ...if the guy likes me & has now shown me hes attracted to me...then wouldnt he knowing my wishes....calm down & behave the rest of the night? I'm just trying to get in a guys head to understand....appreciate your feed back...thanks! mind boggled

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Nov 14, 2010 - 16:37:59

Quote from: JohnDB on Sun Nov 14, 2010 - 16:33:57
Despite the married women trying, but miserably failing to answer your question pointed specifically at Single Christian Men. (some feel the right to butt in to every conversation)

Look...if I were not to make any sexual advance of any kind towards a young lady that I was dating she would feel as if I didn't really like her despite any facial or body language I expressed. It happened enough times on different dates that I got the clue. (Some one finally came right out and said as much)

It isn't that I wanted my dates afterwards to agree...or that I would press hard for the physical intimacy. (it is always a rather weak attempt at best) I simply was trying to express my true feelings for her in a fashion that she would recognize.  

I am always somewhat careful about even whom I asked for a first date.  I need to know who it is that I am going out with...I need to know if she has some kind of history or reputation in the community. Guys are just as vulnerable as women when it comes to dating. Any woman who wants to tell some kind of lie about a guy can trash his reputation very easily making it impossible for him to overcome it in a community.

You, as well, should be rather discerning about whom you accept dates from. Just cause he is in attendance of church and is rather attractive to you isn't grounds enough for a first date.  

Strange why you are always so rude. I have never encountered anyone else who is as rude as you, or anyhwere near it, quite incredible.

  Oh I forgot, I've never been single have I, and never dated any guys either. No thats right.

Because subtlety is lost on you...and even now the most direct and blunt way I can explain it to you also seems to have fallen on deaf ears. It is being chalked up to rude behavior.
The mods have spoken to you on this very subject several times and yet you still persist...what does it take for you to get a clue?

 ::saint::Thankyou...you are right....I dont understand how I can still luv him....I want so badly to let him go & move on......I feel like I'm wasting time....I want to be on my way to finding the man to spend the rest of my life with....do ya think I need closure? sometimes I wonder if I could have answers to the questions in my head from my x fiancee....maybe I could understand him....but that would probably be a bad idea.....it just would probably hurt worse....I know just writing on here tears are falling & I never cry ......very rarely...its hard for me to cry.....so you are right Im still hurting....maybe i should focus on my friends right now & take a guy break? Thanks for your wisdom.  feel free to bring more my way ..God bless mind boggled

This is the singles forum.  In most respects it should be treated as the Christian Men, and Christian Women forums.  If you are single, please keep posting in Christian Marriage to a minimum, and if you are married, please keep your posting in Christian Singles to a minimum.

Singles need encouragement from other singles, in the same way that married folks need encouragement from other marrieds.

Please honor my request.

 ::saint::I dont understand your response...I am single......broke up with a fiancee....I want to be married however have not found a Christian man I feel God wants me to be with......please explain your response to my question????thankyou a sister in Christ...mind boggled

Mind boggled, my advice as a single Christian gal is that you need to just stop dating right now.  You seem so wrapped up in boys(men).  Get wrapped up in God and your life as a Christian woman.

If that doesn't sound like something you can do, well,  you know what your priorities are, right?

I think what JohnDB is trying to describe is where a guy is showing physical affection and that is fine in it's own context.

I think what you are experiencing is that you are grabbing on to any man who gives you the time of day and then getting upset when you feel disrespected.  Make sense?  Women who demand respect do not get treated this way, please believe me.  This is true whether you are Christian or not although I much prefer being Christian  

I wish you the best~

I am not single.  I was once.  I didn't date in order to have sex.  I dated because I truly liked the girl and was looking for a potential mate.  But eventually the passion (biology) would make it quite compelling.  I appreciated being stopped of course as a christian.  But it still wasn't easy.  In my experience, the young lady never understood the difficult internal battle.  That makes communication difficult and invites misinterpretations.  Be open in your communication.  Don't make it more difficult for the guy you care about.  (I'll let you contemplate how you might make it more difficult)  No, we don't think about sex all the time.  Just much of it - and especially when we were young and single. 

Quote from: mind boggled on Sun Nov 14, 2010 - 18:43:09
::saint::I dont understand your response...I am single......broke up with a fiancee....I want to be married however have not found a Christian man I feel God wants me to be with......please explain your response to my question????thankyou a sister in Christ...mind boggled

My response was not to you or any singles.  My response was to marrieds to not overrun this forum as it is a singles forum.

mind boggle asked for advise from fellow christian brother and sisters by the way.  I am not single, but I am a fellow christian brother.

I'm a single Christian man who is spitting distance from renouncing marriage for the kingdom of heaven. However, my reasons for being disinterested in relationships and marriage are so numerous I can hardly sort them out.

Here are some of my thoughts, take it or leave it. I believe a lot of Christian men do not know what it is there is to appreciate in women. When I think about marriage and women from a modern American perspective, which proposes equality, I find marriage and women highly unappealing, and sex appeal is just about the only thing that could be left.

To be absolutely sure, that's not a reflection on (or statement about) you. I'm just saying that there are many things that a man can and should appreciate in women and the culture practically forbids him to appreciate them.

When I reflected on this for the first time, like "what sort of woman would I like to marry?" The first thing that came to mind was all the "equal partner" garbage that I was supposed to find attractive. Honestly, I don't. I like a nice girl with a soft and gentle manner, and is very good at responding. She's also hardworking and is convincing that she's not a competitor in any way. Those things do not make me think "sex" but if I got married I'd be looking for them in a woman.

To be quite honest, meeting foreign-born women was the biggest eye-opener for all of that--along with Bible study, which helps everything.

Long story short--that's my feedback from my point of view. I hope it's understandable and helpful.

Interesting Cally, what you describe as the perfect woman for you is the same as I look for in a horse.  One who knows not to compete for the leadership position, responds willingly and submissively, is soft and gentle (as opposed to stiff and hostile) and an excellent work ethic.  I have not found any difference in horses from other countries although the Hungarian bred Sportlos can be a little hotter than say, the even tempered American Quarter Horse.

Maybe you should get a horse, Cally.  Then you can practice being in a leadership role :)

I'm single at the moment.
I agree with Zoonance in that females are most likely not aware of the power they have over males. We get aroused and then we are expected to turn off like a lightswitch. It's not impossible, but difficult. The guy you're with should be a gentlemen especially if he claims to be a christian. And you should avoid being alone with any man until you are married. Kissing and touching will tie people together, so it is better not to do this prematurely.

I'm at the point I want to honor God in my relationships. I'm not in one right now so it is easy for me to have self control. Sex is not the first thing that I desire. I would like a woman who would say "no" because she desired to be God honoring. On the otherhand, i would like to know that I had the ability to melt my potential mate. Maybe date in crowded areas or at church functions where people can hold you accountable.

Keep saying "no" and let them feel bad. Your obligation is to Christ first.

Quote from: fassopony on Mon Nov 15, 2010 - 15:42:40
Interesting Cally, what you describe as the perfect woman for you is the same as I look for in a horse.  One who knows not to compete for the leadership position, responds willingly and submissively, is soft and gentle (as opposed to stiff and hostile) and an excellent work ethic.  I have not found any difference in horses from other countries although the Hungarian bred Sportlos can be a little hotter than say, the even tempered American Quarter Horse.

Maybe you should get a horse, Cally.  Then you can practice being in a leadership role :)

Heh heh!  maybe i need a horse too. 

i was married to a woman who tried to out do me in everything. i'm needing a little ego building. Those submissive types are very tempting

Advise from now married people can be very useful, as we have all been there and dated and been single ourselves. Just because we are now married, we still remember what it was like and have learnt a lot from our own experiences.
I was single for 6 years quite recently, I have only been married for 5 years, and I also have three adult children and two adult step sons, who are all at that dating stage and one is now engaged.

Quote from: JohnDB on Sun Nov 14, 2010 - 17:08:05

Quote from: chosenone on Sun Nov 14, 2010 - 16:37:59

Quote from: JohnDB on Sun Nov 14, 2010 - 16:33:57
Despite the married women trying, but miserably failing to answer your question pointed specifically at Single Christian Men. (some feel the right to butt in to every conversation)

Look...if I were not to make any sexual advance of any kind towards a young lady that I was dating she would feel as if I didn't really like her despite any facial or body language I expressed. It happened enough times on different dates that I got the clue. (Some one finally came right out and said as much)

It isn't that I wanted my dates afterwards to agree...or that I would press hard for the physical intimacy. (it is always a rather weak attempt at best) I simply was trying to express my true feelings for her in a fashion that she would recognize.  

I am always somewhat careful about even whom I asked for a first date.  I need to know who it is that I am going out with...I need to know if she has some kind of history or reputation in the community. Guys are just as vulnerable as women when it comes to dating. Any woman who wants to tell some kind of lie about a guy can trash his reputation very easily making it impossible for him to overcome it in a community.

You, as well, should be rather discerning about whom you accept dates from. Just cause he is in attendance of church and is rather attractive to you isn't grounds enough for a first date.  

Strange why you are always so rude. I have never encountered anyone else who is as rude as you, or anyhwere near it, quite incredible.

  Oh I forgot, I've never been single have I, and never dated any guys either. No thats right.

Because subtlety is lost on you...and even now the most direct and blunt way I can explain it to you also seems to have fallen on deaf ears. It is being chalked up to rude behavior.
The mods have spoken to you on this very subject several times and yet you still persist...what does it take for you to get a clue?

May I humbly point out to John and the mods that the author of the OP was pleased to hear chosenone's responses, if I interpreted things correctly.

Not to contest the mods' intention for the forum, I'm just wondering how poster may get the feedback of a married person (a particular one or in general) in a topic such as this.

Apologies if I misinterpreted the mods' intention in this particular case--"Keyser" said to keep posting to a minimum. With earlier comments of making these areas "safe zones" I understand the intent.

Thanks all.

Quote from: chosenone on Mon Nov 15, 2010 - 16:23:05

Advise from now married people can be very useful, as we have all been there and dated and been single ourselves. Just because we are now married, we still remember what it was like and have learnt a lot from our own experiences.
I was single for 6 years quiet recently,I have only been married for 5 years,and I also have three adult children who are all at that dating stage and one is now engaged.

You aren't single...YOU ARE MARRIED...if you wished to respond to the poster in question in a private fashion there isn't anyone who would object.

Single people do not want to hear non-stop from the married.
The mods have asked you to please refrain and yet you persist...
Strictly speaking from what I have seen of your behavior you seem to think that the rules do not apply to you. You obviously believe that you are above them for your use of pretty and lovely sounding words.

Quote from: Seva on Mon Nov 15, 2010 - 16:13:26

Quote from: fassopony on Mon Nov 15, 2010 - 15:42:40
Interesting Cally, what you describe as the perfect woman for you is the same as I look for in a horse.  One who knows not to compete for the leadership position, responds willingly and submissively, is soft and gentle (as opposed to stiff and hostile) and an excellent work ethic.  I have not found any difference in horses from other countries although the Hungarian bred Sportlos can be a little hotter than say, the even tempered American Quarter Horse.

Maybe you should get a horse, Cally.  Then you can practice being in a leadership role :)

Heh heh!  maybe i need a horse too. 

i was married to a woman who tried to out do me in everything. i'm needing a little ego building. Those submissive types are very tempting

LOL!!  Well, get a trainer with the horse then.  And, in the nicest way possible, I will tell you this--someone constantly questioning leadership boundaries, be it human or equine, is the sure sign of someone who is not a good leader.

Interesting thing on being single for me (I am not exactly out there looking for a guy right now but what the heck!), number one is the guy Christian.  Beyond that I have found that to me looks don't seem as important, I like brain power and a good spine.  My ex boyfriend (before Christ) is not what you would consider movie star handsome but he is retired special forces, a cop and whip smart.  I had every confidence in him back then :)  Still think he is a good man but glad we didn't marry since he is not a Christian.

I do demand a lot of respect but also a guy who is cool with me asking if he wants to pull my finger.  So, all that is hard to find.  Good thing I like being single!

Quote from: mind boggled on Sun Nov 14, 2010 - 04:19:43
I want to know the truth from my fellow Christian brothers...I'm female...having trouble with dating guys ...Christian & non Christian.....& wanna be Christians....I was engaged...broke my & Gods rules bout sex before marriage....In my heart I would have married him right away...he had phobia bout marriage....he kept sabataging relationship emotionally abusive & MYCHRITIAN PREMARITAL COUNSELOR SAID i'D BE UNHAPPY....I & my fiancee knew this was true..I gave ring back.....now I'm strong bout sex thing....I tell guys how I feel...but doesnt matter....most want it right now....get mad dont call again.....some dont get mad just dont call again....I tell them I dont believe in casual sex.  its hard for me too!....they try to make moves....then act like they have been rejected cause I remind them i believe in having a serious relationship before that would even be a problem & then one should restrain if messed up confess & try not to do it again till marryed......is it that  guys just want sex? do they not like me enough to get to know me?Please tell me how to handle this situation.......I want to put God first before my desires....but I feel like guys dont understand this....help!  

Okay.  VERY heterosexual, EXTREMELY "healthy" 22 year old single guy here .....

We live in a culture were sex is assumed and where usually those dating are "sexually active."  I'm not (still a virgin here - yes, there is one - BY CHOICE, mostly out of respect for marriage and people and dating than out of some purely religious convinction).  But for years, girls have ASSUMED I was - and often pretty disappointed to learn the aweful (and WEIRD) reality....

Yes, you would THINK it would be different in Christian circles, among strong Christian singles.  It's not.  Not by much anyway....

I don't know WHAT you tell you.   I suspect (I don't know!!!) that once a relationship gets sexual, it's hard to turn things back; that might be part of it.  But I DO know this:   Any guy who respects YOU also respects your heart and your values.   AND VISE VERSA.   And I tend to think this:  if they don't respect you, why date them?   That it's HARD, that's very understandable.   I LIVE in that place.  But not getting to "know" them in THAT way frees me to know them in every other way.   And unless we are sexual wimps (and early, frequent sex does make us so?), relationships can still have a physical aspect without an out-of-control tumble into bed.  

And if YOU don't respect you, if YOU aren't faithful to YOU - why should any guy be?  



Good luck.  You need it.





.

Quote from: JohnDB on Mon Nov 15, 2010 - 18:29:57

Quote from: chosenone on Mon Nov 15, 2010 - 16:23:05
Advise from now married people can be very useful, as we have all been there and dated and been single ourselves. Just because we are now married, we still remember what it was like and have learnt a lot from our own experiences.
I was single for 6 years quiet recently,I have only been married for 5 years,and I also have three adult children who are all at that dating stage and one is now engaged.

You aren't single...YOU ARE MARRIED...if you wished to respond to the poster in question in a private fashion there isn't anyone who would object.

Single people do not want to hear non-stop from the married.
The mods have asked you to please refrain and yet you persist...
Strictly speaking from what I have seen of your behavior you seem to think that the rules do not apply to you. You obviously believe that you are above them for your use of pretty and lovely sounding words. Portion deleted.

Your post was pure evil and I have reported it. Its against the rules to accuse anyone of somehow being in league with the devil. Your posts are often incredibly rude, not just to me but to others as well. I have no idea why you are allowed to remain here.
As for the long words,what long words? I have no idea what they are, or what you are talking about.

Quote from: Keyser Söze on Sun Nov 14, 2010 - 18:07:13
This is the singles forum.  In most respects it should be treated as the Christian Men, and Christian Women forums.  If you are single, please keep posting in Christian Marriage to a minimum, and if you are married, please keep your posting in Christian Singles to a minimum.

Singles need encouragement from other singles, in the same way that married folks need encouragement from other marrieds.

Please honor my request.

Thats fine keyser, I will do as you say and keep posting to a minimum. I will message people privately.
My only intention is to help any who comes here asking for help.Sometimes days go by and they get no answers and I feel sorry for them.

Thanks Cally for your support. it is very much appreciated.

What exactly is your question? Do guys only care about sex?
Short answer: yes.
With that in mind, you ought to be able to gauge their relationship with God in the way they treat you.

Mind, I have been a member a very short while and I can see you wrapped up to much in men. It seems your focus is more on men then God. Maybe God is keeping you single until you can find your happiness in Him instead of man. Remember Gods time, not ours. God will not give you more until you are happy with what you hav

Well, if I love you, I can take no for an answer.

And why would you go out alone with someone you don't even really know?

If you can't tell the difference, I would say stay with people you trust, and socialize with guys who stay with people you trust. I mean people who can see through you and obviously are helping you get more with God and finding out how to relate in love with all people, instead of getting isolated with guys who charm you, somehow.

But a church can all be wrong, together, about a guy for you. Pastors, even, have fooled themselves into pronouncing women who trusted them, and their guys turned out to be a no-show liars etc.

So, a group of well-meaning people can all be wrong, together, thinking you and someone are so "nice" or "cute" or whatever together, and wishfully decide you belong with each other.

So, I would say we all need to be honest with God and trust Him to correct us and guide us so we make the right choices. So, as we have said, the main thing you need is to get with God; and God is able to make you honest so you don't fool yourself.

First off, we men are often looked at like our sexual desire is a bad thing. It is not. God created it. Men have to listen to get sex, and women have to have sex to get listened to. We are 'hunters' whose role is to, in effect, to 'conquer' the woman mentally and emotionally.This is not an easy task. A man stumbling around and bumbling up this process is just as normal as a woman who..for instance...doesn't know when to shut up. Evil words by women have caused as much pain and suffering on this earth as have sexual misdeeds of men. What I'm trying to say is don't look down on a young guy who hasn't figured it out yet.

I've not seen anyone actually offer you a plan. Well..here is one. Boundaries. Spell them out. Women have some romantic notion that men should just know what she wants. It doesn't work that way. Virtually any decent guy will accept a celibate relationship, at least for a while, if he truly likes you. But he needs time to prepare. First and second dates are tough. "Does she want me to kiss her?"..."Is that all..or does she want more?"..."Is now the right moment?"... etc. Take the pressure off him and tell him where you stand before he picks you up for the date. This way, he knows all he has to do is make you laugh...no pressure. Imagine you meet a great guy who listens and is a great conversationalists ...you start talking and are having a great time...suddenly (just about when you're going to open your heart) he says..."This is as far as I can go with conversation." That is the awkward position we men are often put in concerning how far to go with a woman. Wouldn't it be easier if you knew the limits beforehand?

Logistically...dress modestly (women often dress to attract a man and then get mad when he is attracted!...aarrggh!), sit in another chair...not in the loveseat with him, and limit kisses to stand up ones only.

I'm a Christian, but I am also a sinner. To be honest, if the woman is offering early on, I'm taking...and then marking her off my 'marriage material' list.  But if she is not, I will always respect her more. You control the sexual boundaries. If you make them clear and then do your best to learn, understand and respect his sexual instinct (don't of deride him for doing what is natural), you will find one who is willing to wait.

I know that I'm new here...don't mean to be presumptuous...just thought I could offer thing that haven't been said here. Good luck!