Christian Forums

LH, you might want to look at these:

http://health.howstuffworks.com/sexual-health/male-reproductive-system/ejaculation-dictionary.htm

http://www.mens-information.com/page3.html  paragraph 10

Masturbation is simply sex with self. Now I have called SEX: Semen EXchange between a man and a woman. This is the one approved by the Bible between married couples.

Masturbation is a game of the mind. While you are at it, you are fantasizing about a man or woman who is not your wife or hubby if you are single. The mind is a platform for transformation for christians. Paul advised that we should continually renew it. We renew it with God's word and positive thoughts.

The devil understood the key role our minds play in our christian development so he doesn't want us to use it appropriately - this is the reason why he brings negative information that are contrary to God's word into our minds.

Now the practice of masturbation with our mind thinking of illicit sex with someone we are not married to is one way we help the devil to corrupt our minds.

Now I am aware that singles will occasionally burn with passion (yes I know because I have been there before), paul advised they get married. If you are still young to get married, you can help yourself to stop masturbation by working on your mind storing the right information into it.

There are so many things you can do.

Christianity is real work and fighting off any habit that gets us disturbed after we do it is real work.

Many who have argued for this habit have not been bold to declare publicly that they do it.

All said and done, don't ever condemn yourself because you got involved in it (don't justify it either) but rather go before the Holy Spirit to help you against it.

God bless you.

Quote from: sesantek on Mon May 21, 2012 - 21:28:36
Masturbation is simply sex with self.

In one sense that could be true but it is not the only definition.  Psycologists and those medical people who study sexual response use the definition: Any form of self-stimulation for the purpose of maintaining or increasing sexual arousal.

QuoteMasturbation is a game of the mind. While you are at it, you are fantasizing about a man or woman who is not your wife or hubby if you are single.

Does that include children who discover it but are too young to know anything about sex?  They can have full blown adult orgasms from it.

QuoteNow the practice of masturbation with our mind thinking of illicit sex with someone we are not married to is one way we help the devil to corrupt our minds.

I agree.  Porn is an epidemic of this.

QuoteNow I am aware that singles will occasionally burn with passion (yes I know because I have been there before), paul advised they get married. If you are still young to get married, you can help yourself to stop masturbation by working on your mind storing the right information into it.

The desire for release is hormonally based and what you are saying ignores that fact.

QuoteMany who have argued for this habit have not been bold to declare publicly that they do it.

In the OP Fassopony said she was "outspoken" and I guess her proof was starting this discussion. I too can be outspoken and will take you up on your challenge, sesantek.  During highschool and college, I did that deed on average about once a day. I credit it for keeping me from going totally insane with desire.  And I learned about it years before I had any inkling it had something to do with sex. (I thought it was related to unrinating)

QuoteAll said and done, don't ever condemn yourself because you got involved in it (don't justify it either) but rather go before the Holy Spirit to help you against it

There is biblically only ONE thing that goes against it: marriage.  Nothing else is listed in scripture for dealing with sexual desires.  Paul NEVER said that if you are burning to get more self control, or pray more or get delivered from demons or crucify the flesh. (not that any of those things are bad) Paul said get married. PERIOD.

Since that is not possible in this day for a 14 year old, and M is NEVER ONCE condemned in the bible (interesting since it was a common religious practice of Egypt) I say let him do it but teach him to NOT fill his mind with porn type junk and lust.

This has been a topic that I have researched in the bible, searched other sources and definitely prayed about.  From what I have found, I believe masturbation could be seen as a sin depending on how you look at it.  Let me explain. 

The scriptures say that all things are acceptable but not all things are beneficial, all things are acceptable but I WILL NOT BE MASTERED by anything!  This includes a lot of things from food to alcohol to masturbation... On the other hand, the bible also teaches in Galatians that we were called to be free but not to use our freedom to indulge the flesh, we are to walk in the Spirit so that we will not gratify the desires of the flesh, one of the desires of the flesh is sexual immorality (or sexual sin) but when you research what that truly means from the worldly definition- it is sexual intercourse or intimacy with someone not your spouse. 

When you desire sexual gratification are you being immoral when you are feeling something totally natural that God gave us the desires to feel? I don't believe having the desire is immoral but the gratification of the desire is what makes it immoral b/c morality is conforming to a standard of right behavior (God's) and since immorality is the opposite of morality then it would be considered wrong behavior b/c its against God's standards.  According to Paul's teaching to the Corinthians - sexual sin is a danger and immoral.  The gray part is when we try to justify if masturbation is actually sex b/c if it isn't labeled as sex it can't be labeled as a sexual sin. Although it is not intercourse, it is manual erotic stimulation of genitalia that results in orgasm...which is sexual.

We are called to control those urges/desires by walking by the Spirit so that we will not gratify the desires of the flesh b/c although God gave us the desires he also gave us rules/advice as to when we are to gratify them.  Paul told the single women & widows if they could not control their bodies it is better to marry than to burn with sexual desire.

What he meant by control their bodies, we don't really know - was it intercourse or masturbation or both? I know the answer I have gotten from my own questions to God is that masturbation doesn't exhibit the Fruit of the Spirit (self control), which coincides with Paul's teaching that if you can't control your bodies its best to marry and also with 1 Jn 5:17 which says all wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin that does not lead to death.

No, I'm not saying - well, if it doesn't lead to death then go ahead and do it!! - wrongdoing is wrongdoing and we will all have to give an account before Christ for all the wrongdoing (sin) we do in our lives. Paul questioned if we died to sin how can we keep living in it? we are not to allow any sin (sexual or non-sexual) to reign (take refuge/rule) in our bodies but evidently its not as easy as it sounds - as Paul also teaches we are wretches (despicable/vile ppl) and when we keep sinning it is no longer us that are doing it but it is sin living in us that is doing it - it is reigning in our bodies - our selfish desires will not allow us to do anything good even when we want to do right, the wrong is what we keep on doing.  With our minds we serve the law of God but our selfish desires make us serve the law of sin. No, we are not to purposely sin but when we do (and we will) -  Thank God!!! Jesus rescues us since there is no condemnation in Christ!   We have to die daily and repent from all sins.

Now, does that mean if you masturbate you will go to hell?  No, I don't believe it does because NOTHING can snatch away your salvation that was given to you by grace through faith - there is no condemnation in Christ Jesus.

However, we do have an obligation to obey the word of God out of gratitude & respect as his children and as Christ's Ambassadors -  and not to mention to receive our rewards in heaven.

I have argued who totally possesses all of the fruits of the spirit at all times?

But God's word says: People who are ruled by their desires think only of themselves. Everyone ruled by the Holy Spirit thinks of spiritual things. If we are ruled by our desires we will die but if ruled by the Spirit we have life & peace. If we follow our desires we can not please God!!  People who don't have the Spirit of Christ in them don't belong to him.  With the help of God's Spirit we can say "no" to our desires b/c only those who are led by the Spirit are his children. Not that we are afraid of him, but that he is our Father - in other words we obey him out of love, respect and a little healthy fear (the same way we obey our earthly parents).

This is not always easy to do and we may not possess all the fruits of the spirit at all times but we have to continue to ask God to give us the strength to do as Paul teaches and make every part of our body serve God so that we will belong completely to him.


WheW!!  Thanks for letting me get that out!!   

Quote from: DaveW on Tue May 08, 2012 - 06:08:34
Do a google search on "Ejaculatory inevitability."  That should tell you all you need to know.  I cannot access any of those sites from here as this is a gov't computer.

These all seem to be like exceptions acccording to the sources I have looked up. For all your attempts it seems that your position weighs on the inprobability that Onab didn't masturbate to ejaculate which is unlikely.

Quote from: sesantek on Mon May 21, 2012 - 21:28:36
Masturbation is simply sex with self. Now I have called SEX: Semen EXchange between a man and a woman. This is the one approved by the Bible between married couples.

Masturbation is a game of the mind. While you are at it, you are fantasizing about a man or woman who is not your wife or hubby if you are single. The mind is a platform for transformation for christians. Paul advised that we should continually renew it. We renew it with God's word and positive thoughts.

The devil understood the key role our minds play in our christian development so he doesn't want us to use it appropriately - this is the reason why he brings negative information that are contrary to God's word into our minds.

Now the practice of masturbation with our mind thinking of illicit sex with someone we are not married to is one way we help the devil to corrupt our minds.

Now I am aware that singles will occasionally burn with passion (yes I know because I have been there before), paul advised they get married. If you are still young to get married, you can help yourself to stop masturbation by working on your mind storing the right information into it.

There are so many things you can do.

Christianity is real work and fighting off any habit that gets us disturbed after we do it is real work.

Many who have argued for this habit have not been bold to declare publicly that they do it.

All said and done, don't ever condemn yourself because you got involved in it (don't justify it either) but rather go before the Holy Spirit to help you against it.

God bless you.

+1.

All uncleaness is sin.

Quote from: LightHammer on Thu Oct 13, 2011 - 14:30:28

Quote from: mrhockey903 on Thu Sep 08, 2011 - 13:50:44
That's great and all LightHammer but that was written by man, not God. It does not explicitly say "do not masturbate" like it does "do not be a drunkard". Don't try to use man's doctrine as God's. I agree with a lot of what's being said, it is hard to masturbate without having lustful images in your head, a lot of times having those images in your head is what brings masturbation about. But like chosen said, what if you're away from your spouse and you are thinking of them at the time? And it also can't be good if it becomes a dominating drive or you over-indulge.

It's very hard to say either way, especially distinguishing between married people and singles. But I don't think anyone should write it in stone saying that it's ok or it's not.

In that case.

This comes from 38th chapter of the Book of Genesis:

    (7) And Her, the firstborn of Juda, was wicked in the sight of the Lord: and was slain by him.

        (8) Juda therefore said to Onan his son: Go in to thy brother's wife and marry her, that thou mayst raise seed to thy brother.

        (9) He, knowing that the children should not be his, when he went in to his brother's wife, spilled his seed upon the ground,
       
        (6)

           lest children should be born in his brother's name.

        (10) And therefore the Lord slew him, because he did a detestable thing.

Onan was sentenced to death by God for ejaculating on the floor. From Sacred Scripture alone it is absolutely clear that masturbation, artificial contraception and any attempts to compromise God's design for sex are wrong in His sight.

Brother Hammer, the sin was not masturbating which I'm sure Onan was not doing, but the sin was withdrawing from his sister-in-law and spilling the seed instead of impregnating her.

Genesis 38:8  And Judah said unto Onan, Go in unto thy brother's wife, and marry her, and raise up seed to thy brother.
 
Mosaic Law

Deuteronomy 25:5-6  If brethren dwell together, and one of them die, and have no child, the wife of the dead shall not marry without unto a stranger: her husband's brother shall go in unto her, and take her to him to wife, and perform the duty of an husband's brother unto her. 6  And it shall be, that the firstborn which she beareth shall succeed in the name of his brother which is dead, that his name be not put out of Israel.

Quote from: Warrior For Truth on Sun Jun 17, 2012 - 04:13:40
All uncleaness is sin.

That is absolutely not true.

Husband and wife sex is commanded in both testaments and makes you unclean. That makes you unclean:

Lev 15:18  'If a man lies with a woman so that there is a seminal emission, they shall both bathe in water and be unclean until evening.

God designed women to have a monthly menstrual period.  That makes you unclean:

Lev 15:19  'When a woman has a discharge, if her discharge in her body is blood, she shall continue in her menstrual impurity for seven days; and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening.
Lev 15:20  'Everything also on which she lies during her menstrual impurity shall be unclean, and everything on which she sits shall be unclean.

Touching a dead body makes you unclean:

Num 19:11  'The one who touches the corpse of any person shall be unclean for seven days.

And being in the same room where there is or was a dead body causes uncleanness:

Num 19:14  'This is the law when a man dies in a tent: everyone who comes into the tent and everyone who is in the tent shall be unclean for seven days.

And the red heifer, whose ashes were required to negate that uncleanness made those who prepared it unclean:

Num 19:2  "This is the statute of the law which the LORD has commanded, saying, 'Speak to the sons of Israel that they bring you an unblemished red heifer in which is no defect and on which a yoke has never been placed.
Num 19:3  'You shall give it to Eleazar the priest, and it shall be brought outside the camp and be slaughtered in his presence.
Num 19:4  'Next Eleazar the priest shall take some of its blood with his finger and sprinkle some of its blood toward the front of the tent of meeting seven times.
Num 19:5  'Then the heifer shall be burned in his sight; its hide and its flesh and its blood, with its refuse, shall be burned.
Num 19:6  'The priest shall take cedar wood and hyssop and scarlet material and cast it into the midst of the burning heifer.
Num 19:7  'The priest shall then wash his clothes and bathe his body in water, and afterward come into the camp, but the priest shall be unclean until evening.
Num 19:8  'The one who burns it shall also wash his clothes in water and bathe his body in water, and shall be unclean until evening.


Jesus Himself touched a few dead bodies in his day to raise them up.  As a Jewish male born under the law, he was rendered unclean by touching or even being near a dead body and had to undergo that purification rite.

Did our Lord sin? ? ? ?

Quote from: Alfred_Ho on Mon Jun 18, 2012 - 04:05:50
Clearly anyone who masturbates is going straight to hell. They are also disgusting and weird.

Based on what?

In the Song of Solomon there is a passage in which Shulamite appears to be masturbating and is called "undefiled." (chapter 5)

Quote from: DaveW on Mon Jun 18, 2012 - 07:47:02

In the Song of Solomon there is a passage in which Shulamite appears to be masturbating and is called "undefiled." (chapter 5)

I see the undefiled as a picture of the bride; where do you get the suggestion of masturbation?

You have to dig thru the layers of symbolism.

Brief guide:  
Garden = genitals.  (common in mideastern erotic poetry)
Flowers = female genitals.   (common in mideastern erotic poetry)
Myrrh (and sometimes frankinsense) = female wetness of arousal. (explaination too explicit for this forum)

vs 2 - sleeping but heart awake = either dreaming or fantasizing

vs 4  - hand by the hole of the door Original text stops at hole. "door" or "latch" added by translators.  The word means either a hole in the ground or a body orifice.

vs 4 - heart pounding - a sign of arousal

vs 5  - Her fingers are dripping wet as she gets out of bed. I am sure several of our ladies here will understand that very well.

Quote from: DaveW on Mon Jun 18, 2012 - 07:47:02

In the Song of Solomon there is a passage in which Shulamite appears to be masturbating and is called "undefiled." (chapter 5)

Quote from: larry2 on Mon Jun 18, 2012 - 10:18:39

I see the undefiled as a picture of the bride; where do you get the suggestion of masturbation?

Quote from: DaveW on Mon Jun 18, 2012 - 10:36:38

You have to dig thru the layers of symbolism.

Brief guide: 
Garden = genitals.  (common in mideastern erotic poetry)
Flowers = female genitals.   (common in mideastern erotic poetry)
Myrrh (and sometimes frankinsense) = female wetness of arousal. (explaination too explicit for this forum)

Oh brother, I'm not into erotic poetry so I reckon I'll just not learn.

Quote from: larry2Oh brother, I'm not into erotic poetry so I reckon I'll just not learn.

Neither am I.  But I did a dig-in-deep study of SOS back in the late 1980s and found all kinds of references to other erotic poetry. So I learned more than I really wanted to. 

When I showed this bit of what I found to my wife, (who had grown up with her mom and the church saying how evil the big "M" was) she just looked at it and shook her head and said "If only those old ladies had a CLUE what was in their bibles...."   LOL!!!

Does anyone believe we're being had by a troll?