Christian Forums

Quote from: LexKnight on Sun Mar 08, 2015 - 10:39:42

Quote from: BondServant on Sun Mar 08, 2015 - 09:19:45

Quote from: His_will_i_am on Thu Mar 05, 2015 - 16:32:59
I've seen a bunch of religious answers, but nothing very practical.

Have you tried a glass or two of wine and a little flirting?

There are some very practical steps you can take to really find out what's going on.

Get her drunk so she'll do something she won't do when she's sober?  That is horrible advice.

There are two options here:  1) Go to counseling, get to the root of the problem and then fix the problem, or 2) Get an annulment and move on.

You really read it like that...? You proved his first point. Concerning the second, it isn't about getting drunk, it's about being romantic and allowing her to loosen up some. Surely you know what romance is, right?

Lol, right on, that's how I read his.will.I.am's comment...a glass of wine ain't getting nobody drunk lol

QuoteHis Will I Am, you wrote, you need to take responsibility for your actions instead of attacking those who point out what you wrote.

I am clearly not the only one who say what you wrote, so perhaps you should consider your words more carefully in the future.

Bondservant, what kind of religious and pious nut are you, and whoever else you're speaking for, to equate a glass or two of wine to getting someone drunk? Seriously now, are you really that old and religious? What more can I say? Other than really? You got some serious dirty in you, huh?

Now to really step on your religious sensibilities. What this guy came here to vent and maybe get some advice about was how to get his wife to give him some. What I read from you old folks and religious, and I mean that in the Pharisee sense of the word, nuts was a bunch of garbage. Before anyone should even think about annulment or professional  counseling, why not give the guy some advice on how to turn on his wife and take her mind off of any possible emotional  trauma first?

Quote from: His_will_i_am on Sun Mar 08, 2015 - 14:09:16

QuoteHis Will I Am, you wrote, you need to take responsibility for your actions instead of attacking those who point out what you wrote.

I am clearly not the only one who say what you wrote, so perhaps you should consider your words more carefully in the future.

Bondservant, what kind of religious and pious nut are you, and whoever else you're speaking for, to equate a glass or two of wine to getting someone drunk? Seriously now, are you really that old and religious? What more can I say? Other than really? You got some serious dirty in you, huh?

Now to really step on your religious sensibilities. What this guy came here to vent and maybe get some advice about was how to get his wife to give him some. What I read from you old folks and religious, and I mean that in the Pharisee sense of the word, nuts was a bunch of garbage. Before anyone should even think about annulment or professional  counseling, why not give the guy some advice on how to turn on his wife and take her mind off of any possible emotional  trauma first?

A glass or two of wine or getting drunk, if it's enough to alter her conscious behaviour she's still gonna wake up regretting what she's done the next day. This problem is much deeper than advising this fellow to pursue her with romance and a glass or two of wine, very bad advice IMHO.

Quote from: His_will_i_am on Sun Mar 08, 2015 - 14:09:16
Bondservant, what kind of religious and pious nut are you, and whoever else you're speaking for, to equate a glass or two of wine to getting someone drunk? Seriously now, are you really that old and religious? What more can I say? Other than really? You got some serious dirty in you, huh?

Now to really step on your religious sensibilities. What this guy came here to vent and maybe get some advice about was how to get his wife to give him some. What I read from you old folks and religious, and I mean that in the Pharisee sense of the word, nuts was a bunch of garbage. Before anyone should even think about annulment or professional  counseling, why not give the guy some advice on how to turn on his wife and take her mind off of any possible emotional  trauma first?

Quoting for the record

His Will I Am...I am going to ignore your baseless personal attacks and focus on what you said...you're misguided beliefs about me are not the topic of discussion, what you said is.

You said to give her a glass of two of wine.  Plying women with alcohol is a well known date rape technique.  You do not need to get a woman drunk, you only need to alter her judgement.  A glass or two wine is all it takes in many cases, and the fact that you are advocating date rape is bad enough.  The fact that you claim to be a Christian, come to a Christian forum to advocate date rape is appalling.  The fact that you would launch personal attacks against those who call you out on it is abhorrent.

QuoteQuoting for the record

You mean what I wrote wasn't already on the record? So you equate a glass or two of wine to getting her drunk and now quote something I wrote "for the record"? Then you want to stretch out as far as rape? How petty are you? 

Quote from: His_will_i_am on Sun Mar 08, 2015 - 14:29:30

QuoteQuoting for the record

You mean what I wrote wasn't already on the record? So you equate a glass or two of wine to getting her drunk and now quote something I wrote "for the record"? Then you want to stretch out as far as rape? How petty are you?

Wow...really?  Are you 10?

EVERYONE knows you can edit your post and then lie about what you said.  Now you can't.  Go ahead, keep digging in your heels and advocate rape.  Frankly, you have shown your true colors.

Do you realize that your logic has pigeonholed everyone who has ever had sex after having a drink or two as a rapist? I could just imagine how people like you would react of I went with my first mind and publicly shared with him some ways to get his Wife so horny that there wouldn't be any more virgins in that marriage. And let me tell ya, a glass or two of wine was just a possible suggestion to help them both relax. I can think of a bunch of other things to help turn  her on and forget about any possible hangups that don't involve wine. But I wouldn't want any of the old religious folks to blush to death.

And to whoever mentioned her having possible remorse for having consensual sex with her Husband, not if he does it right.

Quote from: His_will_i_am on Sun Mar 08, 2015 - 14:43:22
Do you realize that your logic has pigeonholed everyone who has ever had sex after having a drink or two as a rapist?

How you fail to see the difference between to consenting and married adults drinking and enjoying each other and plying a woman who does not want sex with alcohol solely to get her to want sex is beyond belief.

You really need to stop advocating date rape.

Hello everyone,
I didn't think I would get this big of response to my post. I just want you all to know that I appreciate all of your help. I do read every post that everyone writes, even though I do not reply directly to them. But I'm writing today to address a few reoccurring topics as well as update you all.

First off, divorce/annulment is not an option. In my original thread I did write,

Quote from: Pantheon on Wed Feb 04, 2015 - 16:04:03I love her will all my heart, and I would rather die a virgin than consider divorce just because she doesn't "put out".

Secondly, she knows that it is God's intention for a husband and wife to have sex. She does want to have sex (at least that's what she tells me), but she still has this irrational fear/mental block preventing her from going through with it. For example, she promised that we would try to have sex before bed on Valentine's Day, because it was our first Valentine's Day as a married couple. I was so excited; I couldn't focus on anything all day! She even tried to prepare herself; she was wearing what she calls her "sexy nighty." She like never wears that... ever! She was lying in bed, and I carefully got in bed as well. The moment I got in bed, she jumped up left the room. She didn't say anything, and the way she jumped up and left made me think she might have forgotten something that she "needed" or whatever. So I didn't say anything, and I just laid there patiently waiting for her to return. After ten minutes, I got concerned so I got up to find out what she was doing. She was out in the living room on the couch, just sitting there (somehow she had managed to change into sweats). She was like "I'm sorry, I just can't tonight. I thought I could, and I told myself I had to. But when it came down to it, I couldn't. When you got in bed, I knew what was coming next, and I had a panic attack. I just had to get out of there."
Besides, I do not want to guilt trip her into sex by saying stuff like "you have to have sex with your husband or you're sinning!" Where's the intimacy or satisfaction in that? That is not how God intended it to be either. I want/need to be desired by her, not an obligation.

Thirdly, nothing gets her in "the mood." I have read so many articles about how to get your wife in "the mood" and everything they say to do, I already do on a daily basis anyway because that's what I do to show her I love her and I want to be a good husband. For example, last Saturday we had a great day. We spent the whole day together doing fun things. I even took her to a spa, and we had dinner at a very nice/fancy restaurant. Near the end of the day, we were cuddling. I had my arm around her, and she had her head on my chest. It was a perfect moment after a great day, so I took the opportunity. I kissed her on the forehead and softly said, "We could still try to have a little more fun before bed." And boom! It was like Baking Soda thrown into the vinegar! She got up, grabbed her pillow and said, "Why can't we have one nice day where you don't harass me about sex? I'm sleeping on the couch."

Fourthly, bringing up the topic usually ends up with the above reaction. I have asked her if she would go consoling and I have offered to go with her if she would like, I have told her it she can have private consoling if she'd prefer that too. She just flat out does not want to talk about it with anyone.

Progress has been made though... kind of? I did get to see her naked for a very brief moment. She was coming out of the shower one day and had her towel wrapped around her, so I asked "hey beautiful, can I get a peak of that?" I was expecting a negative response, but instead she sighed heavily, rolled her eyes, and flashed me by opening and closing her towel. It probably lasted only two seconds but it made my day! My response was probably cheesy, but my response was "wow! You are the most beautiful site I have ever seen, more beautiful than any other of God's creations!" She replied "Whatever!" wrapped her towel back around herself and left the room. But hey... that's progress... right?

AS I said, this isnt going to change until she get help, both counseling and also for prayer and ministry. To do this you both need to tell people who you trust, its not going to get better on its own.
Does she want children? Does she want a happy marriage? She isnt going to have either unless she actually decides to do something about this. You are coping now, after a very short time, but when 5,10,15 years have gone by it will get harder and harder for you and it does open the door for temptation as God says. 

Quote from: DaveW on Sun Mar 08, 2015 - 21:18:06

Quote from: His_will_i_am on Sun Mar 08, 2015 - 11:26:34
You people are really quick to jump to extremes. Marital rape? Really? What I would simply suggest is to try to turn her on so that she wants it before taking such drastic measures like some of you religious folk suggest.

She does not want to be "turned on." That alone would be a violation of her person.

I don't want my employer to bother me with all this "work."  It's violating my person, too!

Somehow I'm still obligated to put up with it, though...

Likewise, I think by getting married she's given adequate consent to her husband to try to "turn her on" or "get her in the mood."

Jarrod

Sheesh... What Church do you two belong to? Presbyterians against procreation?

Dude, Bro, she has deeper problems than a phobia the Church instilled in her. Do you think she was ever molested? Or maybe gay and trying to be straight out of some sense of Church-based guilt? There have been some (males and females) who have been through project Exodus and never really left their persuasion but were in denial for years. I am not saying for certain she is any of these and at the same time she could be all of these and it takes marrying her to find out that you live in the Bates Motel... shriek! shriek! shriek!...

No offense. Just trying to get my head around all of this.

One thing's for sure... she's in permanent stall mode. There will always be an excuse or a fit.

Maybe it's because she fears you'll discover she's not a virgin...

Have you made that a deal breaker?

Maybe she  loves you so much she doesn't want to lose you.

You mentioned preferring to die a virgin rather than divorce her...

Ask yourself (you have nothing to prove to anyone here) what IF (and I say IF) she's not a virgin?

Would you dump her?

Understand also, I am not trying to put bad ideas into your mind. It is just a possibility that you made her so aware that you would never marry a non-virgin or give your virginity to a non-virgin... that she freaked / panicked / lied / gone into self denial...

You mentioned getting pretty close to the edge of having sex before the marriage. So she was more willing to fool around before the wedding than after? I mean right up to the verge... right?

Don't you see?

If the two of you had not waited until marriage, then her problem would be solved. You both would not be virgins on your wedding day.

Just a thought.

What you have to determine before you even go into the investigation of this...

...is if you truly love her and want her... or you truly want her and truly love her... IF... she's a virgin.

If you truly love her as you say to the point of dying (I assume for her and not for her status as a virgin) then you will come to her with the solution:

"I love you no matter what, honey, and we can get through this,

but it really appears you might not be a virgin...

...and if not, it's not the end of the world! 

And I am never going to hold it over your head!

We have each other. Let's enjoy each other the rest of our lives exclusively."

My guess is you'll suddenly have more sex from her than you'll know what to do with!

I pray the best for you, Bro.

Quote from: 4WD on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 06:58:21
Since the marriage has not been "consummated"  it is not a marriage.  It is only a legal unfulfilled contract.  I would get the contract declared null and void.   Actually it would be an annulment but I don't think there is such a thing in the legal system. I would get a legal divorce.

Quote from: 4WD on Thu Mar 05, 2015 - 09:50:05
They aren't married.  They were never married.  The marriage was never consummated.  The piece of paper from the state has nothing to do with God's laws.  It is only the piece of paper from the state that needs to be corrected so do whatever it takes to get that done and move on in life.  Life is too short to put up with that sort of nonsense.

WRONG!!!!  Joseph and Mary's marriage was not consumated but would have required a formal divorce to break them up. 

The op and his lady both spoke words of committment before God and witnesses and that makes a proper formal covenant.  IT is binding  before God.

And if you think making a covenant under false pretenses nullifies it - go read in Joshua about the Gibeonites.

Quote from: ginger rabbit on Thu Mar 05, 2015 - 12:43:39
A woman who doesn't obey the role of being a dutiful wife according to the tenets of the bible is not keeping to the Christians doctrine. She's not being a dutiful wife, she's not submitting to her husband, she's obstinate and hasn't repented of her sexual sin she's not being faithful to her faith.

While Chosen made a point that the teaching she grew up with is more typical of a century ago, there are still pockets of it here and there. And those pockets would NEVER EVER consider lack of sex to be sinful. 

One of the interesting flukes of the New Covenant is just this situation.  She may have been so ingrained that sex was sinful that no matter how hard she tries; it is a stronghold in her mind that believes it to be sinful no matter what, even in marriage.   And to force her to have sex is to force her to sin. (really sin)    I said "may have been" since we have not heard from her side of the story.

There is too much complexity to really determine what is going on with only his viewpoint, which is clearly (and rightly) one of frustration and anger. But those emotions tend to cloud the facts, of which we have only a few.

JohnDB70X7, I find your supposition that she is not a virgin and is only covering up for past transgressions to be entirely unwaraned.

To the OP:

Did you and your (now) wife have any kind of premarital counseling? 
If so - did they cover sex?

If I were in this situation, I wouldn't feel right about divorcing.  But I might be tempted to tell my wife that I was NOT cool with this at all, and just remind her that if we hadn't had sex, we could get an annulment, leave the room, and let her think about it and start to worry about the consequences of how she was treating her husband.  That's probably not the best thing to do, but I'd certainly be tempted. 

I'd tell her I'd consider a marriage without sex not to be 'a real marriage', like marriage is supposed to be, and that I'd consider it her cheating me.  I'd also tell her I expected her to have sex with her husband, and often, and to be into it. 

If it were a case of molestation in the past, I'd probably take a gentler approach, but still make it very clear that this was not cool, that we were NOT going to have a marriage without sex.  That's non-negotiable, and insist that she get whatever counseling she need and start working on the sex part of the marriage.

She also needs to know that not sleeping with her husband is being a bad wife.  Having sex before marriage is being a bad single girl.  A wife not taking care of her husband's sexual needs is being a bad wife in that aspect of the marriage.  She may not be cheating 'on' you, but she is cheating you.  "Defraud ye not" one another, the Bible says.  Tell her not having sex with her husband is dirty.

I'd draw a line in the sand and put my foot down.  A tough conversation like that is 'unromantic.'  That doesn't mean it has to be unloving.  The Bible says not to hate your neighbor in your heart, but to rebuke your neighbor frankly lest you share in his sin.  If you can't put your foot down about something so basic in a marriage and stand up for yourself, and for your marriage relationship, it's going to be hard for her to respect you down the road.  You are also at a time when you need to be establishing yourself as a leader in the relationship, not just responding to her emotional whims.

One possibly ethically questionable approach would be to refuse affection if she doesn't give sex.  If she says why do you have to ruin the hugging by trying to have sex, tell her you can't hug or kiss because you get worked up and you have no sexual release.  I might do something like that once or twice to prove a point, but not in an ongoing manner. 

After a tough conversation where you tell her she's doing a bad job as a wife, etc., she's probably not going to get all turned on in the next five minutes and want to have sex.  But she'll leave that conversation, think about it, maybe be contrite and cry about it.  Maybe you could pray with her. Hopefully she will repent, apologize to you, and then be open to it.

But after the tough conversation, try to 'seduce' her.  It's not classic common-law seduction since you are married.  You say you've tried everything, but have you really?  What about physical displays of strength-  pick her up and carry her to the bedroom like you are carrying her to the bedroom, pin her down and kiss her.  If it's playful and she's not screaming no, then that's not rape.  It's just displaying physical strength.  That might push some button she's got emotionally. 

Who knows?  Maybe that's not her thing. 

There was one guy who posted on a marriage forum and he said he modified a line from Braveheart, "I demand my rights... as a husband."  Through in slamming your hand on the table at the "...".  His wife was making excuses for being busy and not wanting to have sex that night and they ended up having it.  But they could have had it anyway.  She acted all indignant, and then he said he told her she knew she liked it.  If your wife gets turned on by the tough guy approach, maybe that will work.  It might really turn her on.  But that sort of thing can be done in a playful way, sort of joking around, but also kind of serious. 

Sometimes guys think being really sensitive and romantic, bringing flowers, lighting candles, etc. turns a woman on.  But then they do these things, and their wives don't respond sexually.  But a wife might respond to a man being assertive, resolute, or just doing something 'manly' like lifting a refrigerator, fixing a car, or killing an oncoming sabre tooth tiger that is attacking her.  If there aren't any saber toothed tigers around, you may consider looking for ways to display physical or emotional strength, resolve, etc.  Here is an example of how he 'sensitive guy' approach can be unappealing to a woman.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVmCwmC5-kQ

You can also touch her a lot during the day if you want to have sex with her at night.  And you can make double entendres or comments her what you are going to do to her that night.  Start off with touching her shoulders or hand.  Give her long, 15-second kisses, lots of hugs.  Work up to things like touching her behind and other kinds of touches that would only be acceptable from her husband who she's sleeping with.  If that doesn't work, tell her that you are going to have sex with her that night and for her to be ready, and insist on it if she starts giving reasons not to.  In sales, excuses are 'buying signals.'  You just argue past the objections to make a sale.  If she gets upset it with a joke, deflect with a joke or flirty comment, like, "You know you like it".  If she gets rid of the feigned indignation and cracks a smile or laughs, that's a good sign.  If something you do really makes her angry, stop and go back to holding hands and touching shoulders.  Of course, don't force anything on her.  But do either ignore or work around her excuses.  She's programmed herself to think of excuses to convince herself not to have sex.  Help her get past them. 

If she makes excuses, you could also point out that she's always giving herself excuses to not consummate the marriage.  Ask her to come up with some reasons why she should have sex with her husband.  You could even have her write them down or you could write them down.  You could throw out a few suggestions to start.  I Corinthians 7 verses could be in there. 

Does she shut down while making out?  Many a teen has fallen into fornication after a hot make-out session. If she shuts that down all the time, that may be a problem.  But what if you did sit on the coach with her making out for an hour, kissing and sucking on her neck, gradually working down below the clavicle?  If she shows signs of getting worked up, start taking her clothes off, acting without asking permission or talking to spoil the mood.  If she's into it and not screaming 'no' then it's all good.  You don't have to get her to formally agree to have sex.  You just got to get her to have sex and not scream 'no' or be traumatized.

Some people talked about alcohol and marital rape.  Of course you don't want to rape her.  That could really mess up a woman's concept of sex an scar her emotionally.  But they were talking about giving her a couple of drinks to loosen her up.  I'm not into recreational drinking at all, but Biblically, I don't have a reason to condemn moderate use of alcohol.  But if a married couple do get drunk and they are both conscious of what's going on and have consensual sex, I don't consider that to be 'rape' at all.  If they are unmarried, it could be something close to rape-- a really nasty seduction-- if the alcohol was used to lower the other person's resistances.  A married woman shouldn't have the sense of guilt the next day that a girl who had a drunk one-night-stand fornication experience with a stranger would likely have.  The ethical issue with alcohol is whether it's unethical for a Christian to drink enough to effect their judgment or decision making. 

With fornication and rape, getting someone to lower their resistances to have sex is wrong because it's wrong to fornicate.  But it's not wrong for a married person to get a spouse to overcome resistances to have sex... if they don't sin along the way.  Married sex is not fornication.   If she has been married to you a long time and you haven't consummated the marriage, you are going to have to figure out how to convince her to get past that mental roadblock.  If flowers, candy, dim lights, and romantic movement don't do it, you need to figure something else out.

Also, consider the importance of prayer.  You need to pray for and with her.  You could even pray about the sex situation with her.  If she's willing to repent and ask for forgiveness for her sin of not having sex with her husband, that's a major step. 

Pantheon, couldn't you have come up with a better handle, one that didn't sound pagan?

Btw, there was this Rodney Dangerfield movie about a man whose daughter was getting married.  Her father had instilled the importance of virginity so strongly in her, that she refused to have sex with her husband on the wedding night.  But somewhere along the line she overcame her resistance, and at the end of the movie, she was chasing her husband around and looking for him to engage in some amorous activities.  He was hiding and cowering in fear.  He needed a break.  Anyway, it was just a movie.  You wonder if there is anything in real life that serves as ideas for these movies, though. 

Btw, if it was me and other things didn't work, and she was resistant to getting help, I'd tell her I'd out her and start taking steps to take her in front of the congregation of the church for church discipline.  I heard that the first man disciplined in the first church in the city of Boston was disciplined for the sin of not having sex with his wife. 

Quote from: DaveW on Wed May 27, 2015 - 09:50:28
JohnDB70X7, I find your supposition that she is not a virgin and is only covering up for past transgressions to be entirely unwarranted.

Unwarranted?

Maybe my direct approach is a bit terse to most. But pussyfooting around a topic or ducking for cover (referring to professionals et al) is not the help people need.

   
His last activity here was last March anyway, so I doubt he'll ever read this thread again. I just hope all worked out for him and his wife. 

I've actually met one couple who has been married a couple years, (completely God ordained) but it's the opposite though and the WOMAN is waiting on the man to have sex because of some unresolved issues sort of related to sex. (A wife of his had an abortion so maybe he's scared he's going to get someone pregnant). I also read another case on Relevant magazine where it was painful for the wife to have sex for two full years because of cysts in the cervical area. BOTH were virgins. After her husbands porn addiction she changed her diet and realized chemicals in body products were bad etc and now I'm on different soaps etc because I've already had problems with that. She also write a book.

BACK TO YOU
You are not alone. Other people have struggled with this. Although I can't IMAGINE how you're feeling I'm a virgin amd that is my legit second WORST fear.

Get in contact with God. Only he knows whether you should stick it out or not, and only he knows whether she will eventually work it out.

She clearly is embarrassed even in front of her own friends.

I still think it's rude the way she's talking to you and should have primed you on this before getting "married" to you.

There is an issue because this isn't normal. Maybe choose a friend of hers to confide in. She's clearly mad but if there's no hope for you this is compromising your marriage. You've tried every avenue so keep pressing on and trying new things. Maybe even go to a couples sex therapy group. Maybe learn the signs of abuse and see if that was her problem.

May God be with you and richly bless you. Keep holding on and use this as a time to get closer to God.

Man this sucks, but I can relate, I am 28 and still a virgin and waiting until marriage, but I am probably going to have sex on my honeymoon night IF I ever do get married in my future.

I will find someone and get married.

OP has not been here since March of '15. 

Quote from: Pantheon on Wed Feb 04, 2015 - 16:04:03
Hi
My wife and I are 26 and we got married 7 months ago. We were both raised with strong-values, good morals, in conservative-Christian homes. We didn't live together until after we got married, and we were both virgins when we got married... and we still are...
While we were dating we were often tempted to "go too far" and in these moments of temptation she would say things like "ugh! I love you so much, I want you so bad. I can't wait until we get married." But after dating for 3 years our wedding day finally came. Wedding was awesome, everything was perfect! And being a guy, I was looking forward to the wedding night more than anything! We get to our hotel and the moment we walk through the door to our room her demeanor changed and she said, "I'm super tired from the very long day. I had to wake up super early to get everything ready for the wedding. Please don't make me do anything tonight; I just want to go to bed." I was crushed, but trying to be the loving, new husband I respected her wishes and we went to bed and slept.
[Back story: since we didn't live together before getting married we had to get an apartment together, but that wasn't ready for a week after our wedding. So we stayed in a hotel until our apartment was ready]
Day after the wedding, I make a sexual innuendo to her and she says "I'm just not comfortable doing it for the first time in a hotel room. Let's wait until we get settled into our apartment."
I was more crushed than getting rejected on our wedding night because at least that excuse made sense. So I replied, "You're joking right?! That's a week away! I don't want to wait that long!"
Her: "Please, honey? We've waited 26 years, what's one more week?"
I was hurt, shocked, confused, disappointed, dumbfound, and stunned. I mean what happened to my fiancé that was "trying so hard to resist temptation."
The week went by without as much of getting a glimpse of her in her underwear. We moved in to our apartment together, and there were more excuses. And she said "maybe on our honeymoon." That came and went. That was more like a vacation than a honeymoon if you catch my drift.
Here we are 7 months later... after 100+ different excuses, and my wife and I still haven't consummated our marriage. We have had some serious "sit-down" talks about sex over the months. And she finally told me she's scared (I assumed that after excuse 10, but at least she admitted it). But she blames the church for her fear. She says all her life in youth group, youth church, and her Christian school [associated with her church] that they taught her sex was this filthy, nasty, sinful thing that if you do before married you're not only sinning, but a huge disappointment. She said that after years of that ideology being drilled into her head, now that's she married she can't just flip a switch and be okay with having sex, even if it is with her husband [those are her words, paraphrased].

[Begin ranting]
The only times I've ever seen her naked is when I've purposefully tried to sneak a peak of her while she was changing or getting out of the shower. And that makes her furious!
Out of frustration, I've asked if she's not attracted to me. And she reassures me that she loves me and finds me very attractive.
Most of the time when I say something implying sex, she leaves the room or gives me the "shut up" look. If we're cuddling on the couch or in bed watching something and she thinks I started to make a advance at her, she gets mad as says "why do you have to wreck the perfectly good moment every time?"
A couple times, I've been like "I have needs!" And her response is, "well go on the internet and use your hand" (of course she doesn't really mean that, and I'm certainly not going to commit adultery even if it is with pixels).
[End ranting]

I've been nothing but a loving, caring, sympathetic husband. I've shown her in the Bible how sex is a gift from God intended for married couples. I reassure her several times a day how much I love her and how beautiful she is. But I'm getting frustrated! I've tried everything to get her in the mood! (Trust me; every trick on google has been tried). But she doesn't even seem to be interested in trying to get over her irrational fear. I know she loves me just as much as I love her. I love her will all my heart, and I would rather die a virgin than consider divorce just because she doesn't "put out". But ideally, that's certainly not what I want, and I know that's not God's will either. I've asked her if she wants consoling about the topic and offered to go with if she wants, but she doesn't want to talk about it with anyone. In fact, she told me that if any of my guy friends ask about it, to please not tell them that we don't do it, just tell them it's great. Luckily, no one has asked me about my sex life though. But her Facebook was left open once before logging out I read a message between her best girlfriend (who is also a newlywed) and they were talking about sex and my wife said we don't do it often, but it's good when we do it. I never brought that up with her, because she'd just get mad at me for invading her privacy.

I feel alone, is there anyone else out there who's gone through something like this? What'd you do to get past it?

Let's talk about you, as much as it is only you that I get to hear with regards this situation you say your marriage is in. I gather that you love your wife. And I think that is the very reason why you took her to be your wife and married her. You care for her and want to make her happy. Obviously, that is not the problem and you have no problem with that.

Now, I gather in your story, that you point to her as the one who have a problem, that is, with having sex. Clearly she told you that she's scared, wherever that is coming from. So, that is the problem, at least, as I understand it from what you've written here. And the way I see it, she's scared to the point that she would rather live a lie (sin) than go have sex, even with you, her husband, whom she says she loves and whom she believes loves her. That may well be a very deep type of phobia. And that sure must be a serious concern for you, not only because it's directly affecting you, being a passionate husband, but more importantly because your wife is, I would say, apparently ill. Having established that, I'm sure that what you feel now proves to be to your disadvantage and her as well. It hurts you and her as well. So, I suggest that you quit and drop whatever bad feelings you have right now, and rather be the loving husband you say you are, and feel for her. By doing this, you'll be free from the burden you now have. And for you to be able to do that, forgiveness is the key. You, her, God.

Yes, it is difficult for you, since as you've said, you have needs. But remember, it is more than your duty to support her and help her overcome and be healed. It's hard and it requires sacrifice. To make it a bit lighter for you, let your love work for you. Take this as a great opportunity for you to show how much you love her. Getting her healed is the answer. It will not only heal her, but will bring you great joy as well, and your marriage I'm sure will become normal, happy, and well.

Now, the question is, how would she be healed?

This takes time, you have to understand that. The first thing for you to do is let her understand and feel that you understand her in this matter of having sex. And find ways to take away any pressure or tension on her that resulted from arguments that happened between you in the past regarding this. You know better how you will go about this I'm sure. Next is to be in fellowship with happy married Christian couples, specially those with beautiful children. It will expose her to the beauty, love, and happiness that God wanted for a married couple and family to have, share and experience. And the rest, I think will follow....

May God be glorified in all that you do, and may the healing power of God be upon your beloved wife.

Quote from: johndoo on Thu Feb 05, 2015 - 06:02:40
Your wife has a sex aversion.
She is committing spousal neglect. 
she is not fulfilling her responsibilities in the marriage.
Your options are limited.
You can insist on marriage counseling and sex therapy.
She may be somewhat passive aggressive if she isn't willing to address the issue.
You can go to your pastor if she is unwilling to start the process of counseling to  use the church as leverage to force the counseling before divorce becomes an option.
Books like "Sheet Music" are sex-positive but don't work well if people aren't motivated.

Like this idea. Hope this will help OP.

I, also, suspect child abuse and agree that you first useful task is one of the godly, older, ladies of the Church you are attending and do it quickly because your marriage is about to fail and you will fall into sin, don't let that happen.  And  as rude as this might sound to you, if you get her past the first time, ladies are just like men in the respect that she will never want to quit.  If it is Child Abuse of a sexual nature you have a long hard road in front of you.

Praying for God to bless both of you.

SOMETHING has happened to her.  I really don't know what.  It is possible she has been molested. 1 in 5 girls have been molested. I could even be that she was raped and isn't being honest about being a virgin, although her only experience may have been forced. 1 in 5 women have been raped. A woman's reaction to sexual violence is usually either promiscuity or frigidity.

The first thing I would do is ask her about this.  See if there is something from her past, whatever it is, and if she can talk to you about it.  Once she admits it to you, a big hurdle will be crossed.  Tell her that you're really sorry she went through it, and that you think it would help a lot if she had someone to talk things over with.  Help her to find a counselor (a woman counselor).

The other thing you need to do is back far away from intercourse.  Do a long term seduction.  Pretend you aren't married.  What would you do first?  Little "accidental touches" or a friendly hand on the shoulder.  Give her a long time to get used to that and want more.  By time I'm talking about days, even weeks.  This has been going on with you guys for seven months -- that's a pretty bad habit that's set in, so don't expect it to break overnight.  Next?  Holding hands.  Ocassionally at first, but slowly increase the kinds of occasions where its nice to hold hands.  Remember, you are not even kissing yet.  Make her WANT more.  But only if she kisses you do you kiss. After several weeks of this, THEN kiss her, and none of that open mouth stuff at first.  Just a chaste kiss on the lips the first few times.  Do you see how we are moving her up the scale in a relaxed manner, not pushing her, and leaving her wanting more?  The moment you feel her tightening up, MOVE BACK to the previous stage.  Stay with kissing a long, long time.  Women really like kissing if it's done right.  After weeks of kissing, move to feeling with clothes on, no sexual zones.  See how we are moving this very slowly?  It's like Tai Chi sex. LOL  Just keep going very slowly like this, one small step at a time, over the course of months, backing off if she tenses up, speeding up if she speeds it up.

This is similar to the therapy that they use for phobias.  With phobias it actually takes very little time.  But with your wife, I suspect that it will take much longer because of the emotional issues she is associating with sex.  You can do this even if she is not in Counseling, but it works best if she does both.

Pantheon, what's the status? I hope you stuck with her because love is more than just sex. Her hope of marrying you could be her way of escaping a past trauma, perhaps so bad she has put it under her subconscious. I hope some counselling had been done by mature Christians to help her surface that trauma and help her face it - even by confronting the offender if he is still alive.