Against Rock & Roll Music in Church!

[James2018]

I think one can enjoy the King James Bible AND appreciate hard rock with Biblical lyrics. :)

As long as we agree. It doesn't matter if we enjoy or even if we believe

the KJV Holy Bible. The KJV Holy Bible is the book we're talking about.

[James2018]

Many people associate themselves with a denomination

and not with the KJV Holy Bible.

Many people have not read the most published, distributed,

translated, preached and believed Holy Bible of all time.


The Kings James Holy Bible is the most published, distributed,

translated, preached and believed book of all time.

[James2018]

Really, no, the topic was salvation and the question

was about the relationship of the law with being saved.

The topic was not music.

[NorrinRadd]

Yes, seriously, excellent thoughts.

Let's agree that there is the science and language of music

and that the theology of the biblical music is in a bible,

and the bible we're talking about is the KJV Holy Bible.

Biblical music is not subjective., it's obviously subjective.

The subject is a book and the topic is biblical music.

Brilliant. 

[NorrinRadd]

I think that there is a big difference between hard rock and heavy metal which is largely satanic and the more soft rock pop type music. I just cant imagine the early disciples worshipping to screaming and wearing black etc.
I cant see anything of God in that type of music at all.

How would you categorize this or this or this or this?

[NorrinRadd]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=en80q-upISU

I think these lyrics in this style are really effective, especially among young ppl. (Not necessarily for general congregational singing, though.)

Agreed on both counts.   

[NorrinRadd]

Yes, I'd like to know where the line is for spiritual songs.

Personally, I am among those who take the "spiritual songs" in Col. 3 and Eph. 5 to be related to "singing with the Spirit" in 1 Cor. 14, and to mean songs spontaneously given by the Spirit.  I just noticed that, according to Craig Keener, that is similar to the meaning of "new song" in Rev. 5:9 and in the Psalms and elsewhere in the OT.

[NorrinRadd]

I say this with all sincerity, don't worry about it.
God will explain it to you, probably before you're 70 years old.

Kind of doubtful He'll "explain" to me in less than twelve years what He has not bothered to even hint to me in the past 38 years.   

[James2018]

Yes, seriously, excellent thoughts.

Let's agree that there is the science and language of music

and that the theology of the biblical music is in a bible,

and the bible we're talking about is the KJV Holy Bible.

Biblical music is not subjective., it's obviously objective.

The subject is a book and the topic is biblical music.

Sorry for the previous typo.


I have two graduate degree, but not in music.
I've listened to the Bible Baptists lecture against all rock music.
I've listened to the Charismatics lecture for rock music with biblical lyrics .

The Baptists have much older and developed music colleges.
Charismatics use revised bibles which give precedence to the Vaticanus
and don't know it. State universities have published scientific papers
showing the harmful effects rock music has on plants, animals and people.

[grams]

I  have to  mention some thing here.....

My son when in School was a drummer and every one thought  he was the
best.......!!!  And it seemed  that  he could have been rich belonging to
any band.........  He had a choice to be in any band....But!!!!!!!!!  He became saved and  thing changed....


The  beat.....................................................! 
He gave up the drums......  and  will only listen to music that is
sensible......    He sure knows  a lot !

[faroukfarouk]

I  have to  mention some thing here.....

My son when in School was a drummer and every one thought  he was the
best.......!!!  And it seemed  that  he could have been rich belonging to
any band.........  He had a choice to be in any band....But!!!!!!!!!  He became saved and  thing changed....


The  beat.....................................................! 
He gave up the drums......  and  will only listen to music that is
sensible......    He sure knows  a lot !

Sometimes it can be a bit loud, right?

I'm sure your son must have talents he can put to good use.

[notreligus]

The music that has been called "Rock and Roll" began in black churches.   Those who began the musical style were not the ones who named it for they would have and did call it "Holy Ghost Music." 

It was said when Elvis and others who recorded at Sun Recording Studio in Memphis that they were playing nig___ music.   The bias against this music can be based in racism, not just a musical style.

[faroukfarouk]

There was also something to do with New Orleans wake music....

[James2018]

The music that has been called "Rock and Roll" began in black churches.   Those who began the musical style were not the ones who named it for they would have and did call it "Holy Ghost Music." 

It was said when Elvis and others who recorded at Sun Recording Studio in Memphis that they were playing nig___ music.   The bias against this music can be based in racism, not just a musical style.

Yes, that's an important fact.

There is inner court music and there is outer court music.

[NorrinRadd]

...

Thread: Let's Make a Play List

Some of my faves are in Post#39 above.   

[James2018]

I have two graduate degree, but not in music.
I've listened to the Bible Baptists lecture against all rock music.
I've listened to the Charismatics lecture for rock music with biblical lyrics .

The Baptists have much older and developed music colleges.
Charismatics use revised bibles which give precedence to the Vaticanus
and don't know it. State universities have published scientific papers
demonstrating the harmful effects rock music has on plants, animals and people.

Does anyone have a serious reply ?

[NorrinRadd]

Does anyone have a serious reply ?

Yes:  I don't give a flaming flatus about any of that.

Seriously.

[NorrinRadd]

More for the "play list"...

King of Kings / Jesus, Jesus, Glorious One

I Will Celebrate / When the Spirit of the Lord

The Battle Belongs to the Lord

Adonai

Salvation Belongs to Our God

[James2018]

Yes:  I don't give a flaming flatus about any of that.

Seriously.

This is a perfect example of what happens to someone

when they read a revised bible and listen to rock music.

NorrinRadd your reply was not serious and it was not sincere.

[NorrinRadd]

This is a perfect example of what happens to someone

when they read a revised bible and listen to rock music.

NorrinRadd your reply was not serious and it was not sincere.

I beg to differ.  I seriously and sincerely do not care about your hifalutin mumbo-jumbo.  The fact that I expressed my disdain in colorful metaphor does not detract from the seriousness and sincerity of the view.

[Johnb]

James
1.  Several on this board have 8 or more years of study in theology plus 30 or 40 years of reading and living with the word.  Don't know why you find in important to continually bring up your education.

2.  You have another thread where you contend that there is no such thing  as "the bible"  (PS I agree with that)  but now it seems you are taking the position that the KJV is the bible or at least the best translation.  I do not agree with that.

3,  Just like there are no set rules for how to do the assembly there are no set rules for what music we can use.  I do a house church on Sunday morning where we have traditional church music.  On Sunday afternoon I attend a street ministry and some times preach for them where most are folks you don't see in a traditional church.  They have the new music often with a rock sound.  They now run an addiction program and hundreds of folks have been brought to Christ .  Jesus was a lot more concerned about how His followers treated people than what they did in an assembly as long as it was decent and in order.
Example of the songs
"Going to take a freight train all the way to heaven.  I don't care when it leaves.  Can't you see can't you see what my Jesus has done for me"
Sung to the tune of What that woman has done to me

4.  I prefer the traditional church music but can enjoy the other.  By the way when Thomas Dorsey wrote and others wrote many of the song now considered traditional they were  considered to close to the blues sung in the bars and were rejected.
PS don't tell me I will understand better when I am 70 because I am.  lol

[Texas Conservative]

More for the "play list"...

King of Kings / Jesus, Jesus, Glorious One

I Will Celebrate / When the Spirit of the Lord

The Battle Belongs to the Lord

Adonai

Salvation Belongs to Our God

No Stryper?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsNhNdnwgZg

[NorrinRadd]

No Stryper?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsNhNdnwgZg

I never learned to like them as much as Petra.

Not really one of their "praise" songs, but another I like:  Judas' Kiss.  More of a prayer/lament, maybe.

[Johnb]

Oh Mercy Me

[Texas Conservative]

One of my biggest objections to newer music besides the JIMB-y songs, is that many local church folks responsible for choosing songs choose songs they like but are not meant for group singing.

Some songs are meant to be heard or to be sung by one person.  Just because it is on Christian radio, does not mean it was arranged for corporate singing.

[mommydi]

Weird confession time! 

It's not rock and roll, but I used to love the singing group Avalon so much that I bought a new Toyota Avalon just because they were called Avalons.  I don't know much about car makes/models, but since I needed a new one, and I loved Avalon - I bought an Avalon. I listened to Avalon in my Avalon. It turned out to be a very good car. I miss it. 

My favorite song by Avalon that I listened to hundreds of times while driving my Avalon-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yI2fLt-rLOM

[Johnb]

Tex I understand what you are saying most contemporary praise band have very little audience participation.

[AVZ]

Church music it meant for the worship of God.
It is supposed to be respectful, humble and to His glory.
It is not meant to be for our pleasure, but for His pleasure.

What it is not meant for is to draw youngsters to church, or to satisfy our desires.

Music is an expression and we can translate our emotions with music.
Rock music has never been and never will be an expression of respect and worship.
It simply is an expression of the wrong type of emotion and it should not be used in church.

[mommydi]

Church music it meant for the worship of God.
...
It is not meant to be for our pleasure, but for His pleasure.

I'll need a scripture reference for that one, AVZ.

[NorrinRadd]

One of my biggest objections to newer music besides the JIMB-y songs, is that many local church folks responsible for choosing songs choose songs they like but are not meant for group singing.

Some songs are meant to be heard or to be sung by one person.  Just because it is on Christian radio, does not mean it was arranged for corporate singing.

This is true.  I sing along with those Petra songs when I'm in my car and only God and the occasional horrified person at a stop-light can hear me.  My voice is at least as deep as the "How low can you go?" guy in the "Bada-book bada-boom" commercial.  Not designed for that high range.   

[NorrinRadd]

Tex I understand what you are saying most contemporary praise band have very little audience participation.

These days, they tend to be very JIMB-y, or to have really bland, repetitive lyrics.

They were better back in the '80s.

[NorrinRadd]

Church music it meant for the worship of God.

It is also meant for speaking to each other, teaching each other, and admonishing each other -- Col. 3 and Eph. 5.

It is supposed to be respectful, humble and to His glory.

Psa. 95, 98, 149-150, etc. show that loud, exuberant, celebratory music can fit that pattern.  Either that, or your pattern is flawed.

It is not meant to be for our pleasure, but for His pleasure.

The two need not be mutually exclusive.

What it is not meant for is to draw youngsters to church, or to satisfy our desires.

Chapter and verse, please, to show that including such goals is ungodly.

Music is an expression and we can translate our emotions with music.
Rock music has never been and never will be an expression of respect and worship.
It simply is an expression of the wrong type of emotion and it should not be used in church.

Sorry you're so spiritually constipated.  In my case, nothing turns my thoughts toward God and Scripture better than a few Petra songs.

[Johnb]

I think I will write some contemporary Christian music, I think I will write some contemporary Christian music, I think I will write some contemporary Christian music, I think I will write some contemporary Christian music.
Sorry I could not resist.

[grams]

[[[[[[[[[[Quote from: grams on Fri Aug 03, 2018 - 13:09:02

I  have to  mention some thing here.....

My son when in School was a drummer and every one thought  he was the
best.......!!!  And it seemed  that  he could have been rich belonging to
any band.........  He had a choice to be in any band....But!!!!!!!!!  He became saved and  thing changed....


The  beat........................................ .............! 
He gave up the drums......  and  will only listen to music that is
sensible......    He sure knows  a lot !]]]]]]]]]]]]


______________________________________________________________
Sometimes it can be a bit loud, right?

I'm sure your son must have talents he can put to good use.
_____________________________________________________________

Yes !!!!   8   children   and they know  what not to listen to ..........

[faroukfarouk]

[[[[[[[[[[Quote from: grams on Fri Aug 03, 2018 - 13:09:02

I  have to  mention some thing here.....

My son when in School was a drummer and every one thought  he was the
best.......!!!  And it seemed  that  he could have been rich belonging to
any band.........  He had a choice to be in any band....But!!!!!!!!!  He became saved and  thing changed....


The  beat........................................ .............! 
He gave up the drums......  and  will only listen to music that is
sensible......    He sure knows  a lot !]]]]]]]]]]]]


______________________________________________________________
Sometimes it can be a bit loud, right?

I'm sure your son must have talents he can put to good use.
_____________________________________________________________

Yes !!!!   8   children   and they know  what not to listen to ..........

Sounds like he knows what he's doing